How to make an image of 5.25" Commodore disks

[vintage.mn]

Hello,
I've looked at "The definitive guide to BetaArchive" and did not find any step by step guides on how to create floppy images. There is "How to archive a floppy disk with WinImage", but it looks like that section has not been created yet.

Questions:
* There are are some images for Commodore 64 disks already in Database. Is there any page that would explain how to create such an image (ex. which program to use and any special instructions for that program)? I am a computer collector and have a variety of computers which have a 5.25" floppy drive (PCs with high and low capacity drives, Commodore 64/128). So, I should have the hardware, but need to know which software to use and how to properly make the image.
* The same question about Apple II disks.
* I can probably figure out how to create floppy images of DOS games using WinImage, but having a page that would explain all the recommended options would be very helpful.

I can transfer images from my old DOS/Windows 9x computers to my main internet connected computer.

BTW, the section "How to archive an optical disc using Alcohol 120%" is very useful for creating CD images. If a similar section already exists for creating floppy images, I could not find it, but it would be extremely useful.

Below is an image of a software utility to calibrate Commodore 64 drives that I would like to upload:

[vbdasc]

You could try https://sta.c64.org/sc.html (Star Commander). You will need a special cable to connect the 1541 drive to an older PC, though.

For Apple ][, you could try https://adtpro.com/ . You will need a working Apple with floppy, and some creative thinking and documentation reading to establish a cable connection between a PC and the Apple.

Also visit http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/img/index.htm . It contains interesting information, plus the program ImageDisk, featured there, is a great tool for capturing certain non-standardly formatted diskettes on PC floppy drives. In the past, I've copied copy-protected games (to images) with it.

[mrpijey]

WinImage only works for archiving PC floppies, C64, Amiga etc all uses completely different encoding formats on the floppies and are not readable by a PC drive. There are dozens of ways of dumping a floppy depending on what system it comes from. The general solution for these on a PC is by getting one of the raw data dumpers, such as a Kryoflux device (I've dumped many C64 games successfully with this).

But if there are other ways please let us know, perhaps we can make some kind of general guide of different dumping solutions.

[vbdasc]

The general solution for these on a PC is by getting one of the raw data dumpers, such as a Kryoflux device (I've dumped many C64 games successfully with this).

Yes, Kryoflux is the king, hands down. Now, if only it was a little cheaper...

[vintage.mn]

Thanks for providing the links vbdas.
The Star Commander sounds like a simple enough solution, building a cable would be a project, so.
I've read about ADTPro and have seen people using it in some youtube videos. While I have all the computers needed here, I don't know if I have all the cables needed. Setting up everything needed for that one will also be a project.
I have some old PCs all ready to go, so will try some time using the ImageDisk (or WinImage - it sounds like that one is a shareware).

The Kryoflux does sound like an ultimate solution since it sounds like you can connect different floppy types to a modern PC, but the cost of the controller is too high.

[Darkstar]

KryoFlux only works with single sided C64 disks though. If you have data on the "other" side (aka "flippy disk"), you either need a modified floppy drive (there are instructions for the modifications on the KF forums, but they all require mechanical machining of the metal parts in the drive since you need the drive head to step to track -8 or something), or you need to cut open your floppy and physically flip the magnetic surface in it (the reason being that the "reverse" side has no index hole and that confuses KryoFlux)

Star Commander is not good for imaging C64 floppies. If you still have a 1541 disk drive, you can build one of the X1541 cables and use nibtools to make a lowlevel dump of the disk, which is probably as good as it gets.

[mrpijey]

I would argue the Kryoflux is cheap for what it does since it can handle more or less every format out there in a proper way, instead of having different tools for different formats. And if you have a lot of floppies and put a value on preserving them then the Kryoflux holds a good price.

As for the flippy disks Darkstar is right, so if you are unable to make the alterations yourself or don't want to shell out for a modified drive you'll have to ask a BA member or something for help dumping these floppies.

[Vilmar Vampyr]

I will always be happy to dump any 64 disks (or anything else) for anyone that wants. I love my Kryoflux and have a "flippy" drive. Just throwing it out there. I'm in the states.

[mrpijey]

We would be happy to archive C64 games properly with scans and all, so if you have a bunch of games or apps they would be very welcome.

[Vilmar Vampyr]

That's my plan. I don't have a bunch at this time since most of my disks were copies from back in the day, but I am remedying that on ebay here and there. I uploaded one for consideration already, so we'll see what you all think of that one and we'll go from there. My plan would be to get these in NTSC since several dumps I've seen are actually the PAL versions.

[q5sys]

For 5.25" disk archiving on a modern machine... I've heard people talk about the Kryoflux before, anyone have any experience with the Device Side Data FC5025 USB 5.25" Floppy Controller? http://www.deviceside.com/fc5025.html

[Darkstar]

This is not about 5.25'' disk archiving in general, but about C64 (and other CBM) floppy disk archiving.

Without a mechanically modifying the drive, you cannot dump double-sided C64 disks with a regular PC floppy drive, no matter what "floppy-to-usb" solution you use