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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2015 2:33 pm 
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rkmbrown wrote:
Mac is better desktop OS by far and the OS/updates come free now. ++
Linux code is open source and anyone is free to make their own / improve it over time. ++

Apples and Oranges. Wouldn't you rather play a nice game of chess?


I would recommend Macs to unexperienced people. However, ovctvct is an experienced user. He surely knows how to maintain his PC.

I would say dualboot Linux with Windows for these 8 years. Get used to it, and if you hate it, you can always look at the new releases of Windows. In the end, it's up to you.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:41 pm 
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nedvire wrote:
rkmbrown wrote:
Mac is better desktop OS by far and the OS/updates come free now. ++
Linux code is open source and anyone is free to make their own / improve it over time. ++

Apples and Oranges. Wouldn't you rather play a nice game of chess?


I would recommend Macs to unexperienced people. However, ovctvct is an experienced user. He surely knows how to maintain his PC.

I would say dualboot Linux with Windows for these 8 years. Get used to it, and if you hate it, you can always look at the new releases of Windows. In the end, it's up to you.

I use a mac pro retina laptop w/16gig ram as my development computer. I plug it into a few 27" monitors, an external keyboard, and a large track ball mouse. I run a few linux images at a time in vbox. I develop open source code that runs on linux platforms.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:14 pm 
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as a few users have already said, it really depends on the distro. Linux is generally more open and tinkerable, while OSX is geared towards the normal consumer while allowing a developer/hacker to do whatever they want with the software (up to rather a large extent). Linux Aldo supports a lot more hardware that OSX (obviously), and while you get rigs such as hackintoshes the hardware choice is limited. personally, I'd go with Linux.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 5:20 am 
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I am genuinely surprised, despite this being a really important topic now that free software is more important than it ever has been, that this topic has ran this far and no one has really bothered to explain that "Linux vs Mac" is not really the comparison being made here, as Linux is merely the kernel and the OS as a whole is really how the distributor chooses for it to look and act by default. As an example, WebOS, Android, Fire, Fedora, and Ubuntu are all operating systems powered by the Linux kernel. Therefore, more accurately, this would be comparing Gnu/Linux vs Mac OS X. If comparing the classic Mac OS, even HURD would win over it in several respects. There are advantages to the classic Mac that cannot be ignored, but there are good, historical reasons for it being superseded by the great Mac OS X.

So, if we are discussing [Mac] OS X, now just "OS X" per marketing, then we have to look at the kernel and the OS core first, which is far superior to Linux, and therefore would win, as any BSD or like system, OS X/Apple Darwin included, easily triumphs over Gnu/Linux in terms of configuration, security and performance, and this is coming from someone who has used and written apps on it for several years (but with systemd, I'm not even sure for how much longer, as it is rapidly destroying a good platform). Gentoo and Slackware are perhaps amongst the best distributions to date, (and Debian honestly *used* to fall into this class), but in terms of their history and core, again, a BSD (OS X included in said family) wins without question.

With Leopard, one unified system could run binaries dynamically written for x86, x86_64, ppc32, and ppc64. No other widely used system (there are exceptions) has been able to do this on one disc or inside one united OS; Linux runs on a plethora of architectures, ranging from a crock pot (seriously) to a server or supercomputer, but despite it's prowess, because it needs more to work other than just itself, Linux isn't just one piece and OS X proves superior again. However, from Hackintoshing experience, Linux easily wins in ease of use for installation and firmware. Mac OS X is designed innately and intentionally to run on nothing more than an Apple-labeled computer (i.e. the SLA) and the system does not include custom firmware. You either have to scour the Web for it and install it yourself, or build it. Gnu/Linux wins in this area easily because a federation of hackers around the world are constantly adding to it every day. As an illustration, even a notebook I purchased had working github drivers written for a chip it used and was working within less than a week. Linux is designed to be truly open, unlike Apple that follows a hybrid model, and for that reason, despite the Mac's engineering superiority and BSD roots, Linux would win in this respect.

If user experience with the Aqua UI (regardless of its evolution), it clearly wins over a conglomeration of packages heaped on top of each other to imitate it (aka. Gnome 3's Adwaita). While Gnome does try to keep things as tightly knit as possible (particularly after 3.14), it does not compete with OS X. MATE is rather well-designed as well, being a Gnome 2 fork, but there is no guarantee even then your apps will work as one. I could go on with KDE SC which mainly uses Qt applications, but also winds up using Gtk in the mix whenever one needs it, and is modeled after (i.e. imitates) Windows Aero (or at least from what I can observe; being a Mac fan, I don't really use KDE). Mac OS X (in the past, at least) does not do this, and since it has an award-winning Human Interface Guidelines set with a professional team that enforces it, along with good APIs and a unified structure throughout the entire operating system, Mac OS X through virtue of Aqua and the Apple heritage it inherits from the classic Mac OS and that from NeXt, it wins again.

The ongoing work on GNUstep is quite good however, and Canonical is doing its darnedest to make Unity work well, though this has seen mixed results. Elementary also has tried to make a quality UI for the "Linux desktop" and seems to be doing well. While there are differing opinions as to who is better, there just is not unification when it seems every other group wants to fork something, and no two sets of applications are unified to each other. Even package management, window managers, different configurations (different distribution families can use different directories; RHEL vs. Ubuntu Server as an example), security implementations (the difference between AppArmor, SELinux, etc.) is enough to make an experienced IT or developer type gnarled. Mac OS X is throughly designed and wins in that area. But it does have real faults, like outdated ports of core utilities, etc. that usually need to be compiled by hand or pulled down from Homebrew, etc. to create an up-to-date system. Configuration is left up to those that know on OS X, and even the firewall is turned off by default (or services are allowed through it) unless you define what you want. In this scenario, Gnu/Linux is much more straightforward and wins as it expects you to learn as you run it. But this, again, depends on the OS you are using (aka. the distribution).

In summary...

- If you want a solid, clean, unified system with one of the better UI designs on Earth, want to edit home media or do media authoring, or if you want to run a Web server or have a computer that is incredibly easy to configure with a certified Unix (since Leopard) that works, use Mac OS X. More reasons in favor of OS X would be to run a large library of supported, and non-free programs, or if you want a very good, well-engineered development environment to use with both open and closed IDEs available on it, and want to use your iPod, iPad, or iPhone with it and want your devices to work as one. You do, however, sacrifice your freedom to Apple, because although you get APL licensed material and a partially open source model for a system, you are at the mercy of Apple, regardless of whether to own and buy a Mac, Hackintosh, or both.

- If you want freedom (as in liberty and human rights), not freeware or 'free beer' as often quoted by the FSF, then get, use, and eventually give back to systems like Gnu/HURD, Gnu/Linux, Haiku, Illumos/OpenSolaris, and other free software. Obviously, Linux-based operating systems fall into this definition and you get the full advantages, and since we're discussing Gnu/Linux, let's keep it there. While OS X gets professional support, so does Red Hat, Canonical, and others. Gnu/Linux may not be unified, but it does have several organizations and foundations that govern it with several leaders, although it is largely free not just to the public, but anyone who wants to fork something, respin it, etc. which has led to good (i.e. LibreOffice, SmartOS) and bad (900+ distributions and growing). For more vast configuration, overall control, no privacy (ie. NSA) holes (so far, systemd might be it, though this is unverified as of yet), and for customization that triumphs over the closed mentality of Apple and their operating system, Gnu/Linux is for you. But know that you will need to learn it to use it, as it is like owning a sports car without knowing how to drive the car if you don't.

To me, looking at the comparison this way would be a fair, unbiased comparison between the two, and it is ultimately up to each user to choose what he or she wants to run for themselves.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:41 pm 
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I'd jump to linux if it wasn't so damn confusing to use
even those who are ms-windows lookalike

the file manager, and some advanced options
let alone UI customisation is... nightmare

then comes emulation, did wine leap forward alot at all ?
can we play 2008+ win32 games on it ?


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:20 pm 
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I prefer osx for daily desktop usage. I like the way you drag and drop new programs in single packages, the ui... I just find it very comfortable. If you need more power, you can use package managers like fink, macports or homebrew, which will make it more unix/linux like. Another thing I love is how parallels integrates with the virtual desktops. When I used osx, I had windows, osx and linux in a triple monitor setup, and switching from one to the other with virtual desktops was completely seamless. Not saying you can't do it on linux, just that setup was particularly nice.

Linux is what I would choose for servers or when you want to do something more exotic. Stuff like a remote boot, going nuts with virtualization, doing things with files (snapshots, unions, binds, all filesystems together), scripting the whole system, making the system from scratch... anything. Just take a look at how many things can be configured when compiling a kernel. Those are many use cases where linux would be helpful.

This doesn't mean you can't do many of those things on osx, or that you can't get a nice desktop experience on linux, I've done both. This is just my preference if you force me to choose. OSX is a great install and go, easy to use, slick experience, and linux will let you do literally anything. My only problem with OSX is buying an expensive mac and then depending on apple until they want to give me support, but that's another story.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:46 pm 
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I've been using Linux since the early 2000s, and Macs since the mid-90s; I cut my teeth with PC-DOS in the early 80s.

The final word between Mac and Linux comes down to this: how much do you value your time? In my experience, that's been a deciding factor for many people.

Linux doesn't cost you a dime; instead, you'll pay with the time it takes to install and configure everything, as well as learning how to do all of that. It also takes time to solve the frustrating-yet-somehow-fun problems that inevitably come up—like banging your head against the wall because of systemd. It is satisfying, though, in that you'll be able to alter pretty much any part of the system, if you so choose.

Macs will cost you a pretty penny, but you probably won't spend much time getting it to work or learning how to work it...as long as your day-to-day needs aren't too esoteric. It's simpler and faster to get going, and it can do just about anything Linux can, but it comes with a price: not only do Macs cost actual money, they also lock you out in a way that Linux never will.

One is not really better than the other. They're both tools: in one pair of hands, one is more useful; in another, the other one is.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:53 pm 
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badmoon wrote:
I've been using Linux since the early 2000s, and Macs since the mid-90s; I cut my teeth with PC-DOS in the early 80s.

The final word between Mac and Linux comes down to this: how much do you value your time? In my experience, that's been a deciding factor for many people.

Linux doesn't cost you a dime; instead, you'll pay with the time it takes to install and configure everything, as well as learning how to do all of that. It also takes time to solve the frustrating-yet-somehow-fun problems that inevitably come up—like banging your head against the wall because of systemd. It is satisfying, though, in that you'll be able to alter pretty much any part of the system, if you so choose.

Macs will cost you a pretty penny, but you probably won't spend much time getting it to work or learning how to work it...as long as your day-to-day needs aren't too esoteric. It's simpler and faster to get going, and it can do just about anything Linux can, but it comes with a price: not only do Macs cost actual money, they also lock you out in a way that Linux never will.

One is not really better than the other. They're both tools: in one pair of hands, one is more useful; in another, the other one is.


Typically I would say not to bump topics that haven't been posted on in 90 days; but since this is somewhat relevant, I'm going to allow it. :p

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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 12:33 am 
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They're both made for completely different things.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:53 am 
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i'd disagree
they are both MADE to be OS for users
it just goes down to what is "served" and in what way

i rather like user friendly OS, it doesn't have to be pre-configured (which is where Linux fails to me)
but make it easy to control and understand, then let me configure it


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:42 pm 
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Roo_the_Vickty wrote:
i'd disagree
they are both MADE to be OS for users
it just goes down to what is "served" and in what way

i rather like user friendly OS, it doesn't have to be pre-configured (which is where Linux fails to me)
but make it easy to control and understand, then let me configure it

I'm a little confused with this. You say it doesn't need to be pre configured and that's where linux fails for you. Correct me if I am wrong but linux is the only real option for a non pre configured os. Viewing this is a linux vs mac thread it IS the only option. Besides that, if it was a typo and you meant does need then ubuntu is a good linux alternative to mac fitting that user friendly and pre configured mandate. Not taking sides because I am severely biased, just a bit confused.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 4:21 pm 
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With an OS you are getting an "Experience" whether that is the idea of a community, a person, a brand etc...

Linux and Darwin are just kernels that run the experience, with OSX you are getting the vision of Steve Jobs and now Tim Cook and others, a bright shiny GUI with a simplistic approach and whilst it can be tweaked, settings are hidden under the hood to most users.

With Linux Distro's, you get the vision of the creators and the community, take Linux Mint, its designed to run on older hardware and runs pretty smooth. Compared with Ubuntu which is more designed for the current Gen (not to say you cant run it on older hardware, its just something like Mint will feel smoother). CentOS/Redhat on the other hand are designed for server use and Centos is nice and minimal. Slackware feels like the older style of Linux/Unix and tries to conform to the original principles of Unix. If you want a lot of control over customization go with Gentoo, you will have to build the system from the sources, but have greater control in what packages you want.

The other thing is if you care about Unix (and want to avoid systemd) you should consider looking at the *BSD. FreeBSD is very much like Ubuntu nice and fully featured with a lot ready from the get go. OpenBSD on the other hand is nice and minimal like CentOS with a focus on security, although its like Gentoo in that you have to compile pretty much anything other than what comes with the standard packages.

I would just recommend trying out different OS's and basically try and do your "normal" work in them and see if you fight with it, or if you feel comfortable with it. Make a list of things you want to do, such as:

- Listen to music, or internet radio
- Write a document
- Sync some files on the internet
- Check your email outside of a browser
- Browse the web

Then see if you like the community check forums, mailing list etc. Then report back here with your findings :)


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 9:43 pm 
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merlix wrote:
- Listen to music, or internet radio
- Write a document
- Sync some files on the internet
- Check your email outside of a browser
- Browse the web

Then see if you like the community check forums, mailing list etc. Then report back here with your findings :)


Funny thing is for people like me these normal day to day tasks are exactly the same on almost any OS except for listening to local music. I use chrome and Google docs. I guess you could consider me very fluid in that way or that I have put myself into a corner, all about perspective :P I couldn't agree with you more about actually trying different operating systems out, too many osx/windows haters who haven't even tried for more than a couple minutes what they "hate".


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 9:55 pm 
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Ugh id love to have working osx snow leo
But apple never does os for generic hw just their own
While in vm it lags


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 12:15 pm 
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I should have said earlier- I choosen linux mint. Because it's light on hardware, unlike windows or mac os x, and especially, does not require mac hw.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:51 pm 
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Linux Mint is a good choice. For basic usage, the UI is close enough to Windows. Although I only boot Linux from USB sticks.
And OS X is unfortunately tied to Apple Hardware.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:23 pm 
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Mac OS X is just another Linux distro. Personally I stay away from commercial operating systems as you are at the mercy of a company. Besides Apple's technology is way too locked down & expensive for me. You can't even buy a simple cable without having to go through Apple.

IMHO Linux Mint is the best if you want a simple to use Linux or go with Arch Linux if you are or want to be a power user. In the end it depends on your preferences and what type of hardware you want it to run on. e.g. some Linux distros don't do well on old hardware.

Don't know if it is any good but I found an online wizard that is supposed to help you to decide on the best distro.
Just search for "selectsmart" & then search on their site for Linux.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:21 am 
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...which is interesting since OS X is not based on Linux but BSD and Mach, and BSD nor Mach is not Linux. Get your facts straight please.

And what's best depends on your hardware, needs, skills and the time you are wiling to spend to learn. Easy as that.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2017 10:57 pm 
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mrpijey wrote:
...which is interesting since OS X is not based on Linux but BSD and Mach, and BSD nor Mach is not Linux. Get your facts straight please.

And what's best depends on your hardware, needs, skills and the time you are wiling to spend to learn. Easy as that.


So if I am correct, macOS is at its roots really UNIX (or some form of it).

It may look like this then:
macOS/OS X is based on
Darwin which is is based on
the XNU kernel which is based on
a modified version of the Mach kernel which is based on
BSD's kernel which is based on
BSD.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:32 am 
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TuneableSumo876 wrote:
... the XNU kernel which is based on
a modified version of the Mach kernel which is based on
BSD's kernel which is based on
BSD.

Mach Kernel != BSD modified kernel.

"Mach was developed as a replacement for the kernel in the BSD version of Unix, so no new operating system would have to be designed around it."
"Mach is the logical successor to Carnegie Mellon's Accent kernel."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mach_(kernel)

Next time please do your homework better before posting fscking nonsense :-P.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 7:49 pm 
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Hyoenmadan86 wrote:
TuneableSumo876 wrote:
... the XNU kernel which is based on
a modified version of the Mach kernel which is based on
BSD's kernel which is based on
BSD.

Mach Kernel != BSD modified kernel.

"Mach was developed as a replacement for the kernel in the BSD version of Unix, so no new operating system would have to be designed around it."
"Mach is the logical successor to Carnegie Mellon's Accent kernel."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mach_(kernel)

Next time please do your homework better before posting fscking nonsense :-P.


Oops. I will fix that soon.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:29 am 
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Seeing as this has been brought up again. Dual boot option or running linux in a VM are the best ways to try it out. Hey it may not be your thing. That is ok use what you think is the best OS for
you be it Windows, Linux or OS X.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Linux vs Mac- which one is better?        Posted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 2:57 pm 
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I would say a Mac because it can run all three operating systems-- macOS, Windows, and of course Linux.


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