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 PostPost subject: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 1:45 am 
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I installed 3718 in VMWare 7, and immediately enjoyed it as a large stability and functionality increase from 3638, which was the only 3xxx I had tried until that night.

If anyone has any information on the below experiments that could help me move forward, please enlighten me.

Experiment 1: VMWare Tools

I tried to install VMWare tools and found immediately that they failed due to the version of Windows Installer and the fact that the updater couldn't update that version.

I found a way around that, and got Windows Installer 3.1 on there just fine (details will be posted on that in this thread soon). Once I did this, I found that the tools still would not install. They just skipped the install part and went to "Finish".

I grabbed the 6.5 driver pack and put video/audio drivers on there, but could not find a way to manually install the tools from the 6.5 pack. I didn't want to uninstall 7 just to get the ISO from 6.5 and then reinstall 7 and try it, because I was unsure if it was worth all that effort. Do 6.5 tools work with 3718?

Experiment 2: DirectX 9.0c

I then moved on to the next thing on my agenda, as I noticed the version of DX reported itself as vanilla 9.0. I tried the DirectX 9.0c for Longhorn pack (which was hard to find, mind you), some custom registry tweaks to the version, and copying certain missing files (d3dx*.dll) which were curiously missing from all packs. Nothing worked, and even while the version number in dxdiag changed to reflect the version as 9.0c (though it didn't say 9.0c, just the 9.00.blah number changed), games I tested refused to run due to missing DLLs, even if the DLLs were present in the system32 folder. It is worth noting that I was running the games from a network drive on the host, but in Oblivion's case, my main test game, it didn't seem to impact the test (other games complained due to the fact that it was a network drive).

BTW: I am aware that this may hose DCE, but if it does, it's a sacrifice I'm willing to take, as I can live without it.

Experiment 3: Plex Transplant to XP

I had a thought while looking at the pretty Plex theme and all the fail copies for XP that are out there. Why not just transplant uxtheme.dll from Longhorn to make Plex work?

I tried this, and found that you can do so with replacer quite easily, but be sure to reboot immediately or it will SFC replace the dll.

It worked with Plex/uxtheme from 3683 and 3718. DO NOT try it with 4008 (which refuses to boot in VMWare 7, even in safe mode.. I mounted the virtual hd to get the files), as it will make XP refuse to load explorer, and argue with you whenever you try to launch anything, be it task manager, command prompt, etc. It is quite annoying and I'll be redoing my XP VM due to this (I had no snapshots, it was in WVPC).

Plex works pretty well on XP except context menus, which lack the mouse-over effect and instead render in ugly white on the blue background. This effect is messed up in both the 3683 and 3718 versions of Plex in slightly different ways. I imagine that there is another DLL i need to transplant, and if anyone could shed some light. Random suspicions point toward xpsp1res.dll, though I don't know what that DLL is for, exactly.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 1:57 am 
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i would like some screens of the theme on XP :D

all in all seems like interesting experiments

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:05 am 
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I just booted up my XP VM which still had the 4008 files on it, and being less tired realized the relevance of the error message:

The procedure entry point DCEQueryMode could not be located in the dynamic link library USER32.dll.

This basically means that 4008's uxtheme checks to see if it's in DCE or not whenever it renders a window. A user32.dll replacement or a stub function could fix this (a stub is beyond my capabilities though).

I'm going to try replacing user32.dll and report in again.

Edit: Whatever you do, don't try that. It borked the XP so bad that it won't even boot glitchily like before.

Edit2: I figured out that only 3683's uxtheme will work with XP. I am bout to replicate my results last night using 3718's theme with the 3683 uxtheme. In the meantime here's a screenshot of my XPFLP VM running Plex 3683 with no problems. ;)

PS: apparently there's no null device on FLP, so replacer.cmd doesn't work until you add one - googling reveals instructions on this.

Image

Here's the instructions to get Windows Installer 3.1 runnin' on Longhorn 3718 (and probably any 3xxx) as promised (written by me, but quoted from a text file):

Quote:
Windows Installer 3.1 on Longhorn 3xxx

Get the installer for Windows Installer 3.1 from MS for XP.

Extract the installer using something like UniExtract or manually using the Administrative extract feature of MSI files.

Copy the files from the langspecific/yourlanguagehere folder, in most cases enu, to the "update" folder.

Run the update.exe in compatibility mode for XP.

You will get one error trying to find SPUNINST.EXE. This is unimportant, and cannot be circumvented (at least I couldn't).

Just hit cancel, and it will ask you if you want to skip this file.

Hit yes.

Finish installing it as normal.

It is worth noting that I also changed the build numbers in the registry under HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion from 6.0 and 3718 (in my case) to 5.1 and 2600.


Edit3: Yes I've figured out the secret to Plex on XP - Longhorn 3683's uxtheme.dll isn't tied to DCE yet, and any newer ones are. It is, however, compliant to Longhorn theme standards, so any 3xxx theme (and probably early 4xxx and who knows what else) should work. Here's a screenshot of that same VM running 3718's Plex:

Image

I'm gonna try 4008's Plex now.

Edit4: Unfortunately 4008's plex does not work. This means that I've managed to uncover a method to run any Longhorn 3xxx themes only. luckily 3718 Plex fixes the horrible caption button issue in 3683.

I wish I could make additional posts instead of editing this one every 10 minutes or so, it's going to be quite messy.

Edit5: Does anyone know what builds did NOT have DCE/DWM dependency in their uxtheme files? I doubt you do, but it'd save me a lot of mucking around.

Edit6: I realized there is also themeui.dll while browsing the contents of a .theme file, and attempted replacing it. Didn't hurt anything, but didn't resolve the issue with the context menu appearance either.

Edit7: Tried shellstyle.dll, same innocuous effect. Tried shell32.dll, had issues with functions that weren't in ntdll.dll, then some other dll. Clearly that isn't compatible. There's a patched uxtheme 3683 dll I have somewhere, I'm gonna see if that works to let me use my modified plex that I made a few minutes ago to resolve the ugly context menu problem.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 9:25 pm 
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Yushatak wrote:
Edit6: I realized there is also themeui.dll while browsing the contents of a .theme file, and attempted replacing it. Didn't hurt anything, but didn't resolve the issue with the context menu appearance either.

Edit7: Tried shellstyle.dll, same innocuous effect. Tried shell32.dll, had issues with functions that weren't in ntdll.dll, then some other dll. Clearly that isn't compatible. There's a patched uxtheme 3683 dll I have somewhere, I'm gonna see if that works to let me use my modified plex that I made a few minutes ago to resolve the ugly context menu problem.


Image

It's the Universal Theme Patcher (http://deepxw.blogspot.com/2008/11/universal-theme-patcher.html) screenshot. It's not so important, that it is an old version, but.... it supports only Vista & 7!!!! And now read what screenshot says: "Windows XP/2003 only need to patch uxtheme.dll. Vista/Windows 2008/Windows 7 need to patch 3 files." So, maybe MS in the beginning of Longhorn development makes the thing, that 3 files (not 1 - uxtheme.dll like in XP) are responsible for themes!!! I don't know what to do, because there is only 1 uxtheme.dll file in XP, so you can't move new Longhorn themes to XP. BUT!!!!!

Try taking theme from 4039, and importing to 4015. If it'll work, congrats! If not, then take shsvcs.dll, themeui.dll and uxtheme.dll from 4039 and import to 4015, too.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 11:58 pm 
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I dont have VMs for the 4xxx series up yet. I will try transplanting shsvcs.dll, as by its name and description I had skipped even though I had thought of it before due to research on "the Google". Will report back (probably with a whole new mess of edits).

Thanks for the feedback, and when I move to 4xxx testing from 3xxx I'll certainly try that transplant from 4038 to 4015.

Edit: shsvcs.dll did not fix the problem, didn't break XP but it did make the shell take longer to show up.

Edit2: Maybe later Longhorn stuff (4xxx+) could be transplanted onto Vista/7.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:39 am 
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did you try putting DCE and related fines and registry entry's into the proper folders?

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 1:27 am 
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No I haven't given that a go - I'm not too knowledgable about DCE though, so I'd need some pointers on what would need to be copied over/replaced.

While it'd be cool to see DCE on XP, that won't fix the context menu problem, as DCE isn't tied to the theming engine on 3683 where the uxtheme.dll I am using came from.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:35 am 
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There is also 3706. Go to FTP and download it. Go to I386 folder in ISO and take out uxtheme.dl_ and unpack it winrar. Then import in xp andtry applying 3718 theme.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:15 am 
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IMO, 3683 > 3718. 3718's stability was bad, esp. with DCE.


Ontopic:
Interesting project.
Are there any other stuff broken besides some Plex context menus (Firefox contect is b0rked on Plex)?

Paging Thomas Hounsell.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:24 pm 
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I don't use Firefox, so I wouldn't know. AFAIK there's no other issues whatsoever.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 11:00 pm 
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On VMware, 3718 and 4008 keep asking for a "PCI to IDE Standard Channel blahblah." Seems like it has something to do with VM sound, as disabling that disables the missing devices.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 9:25 am 
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I agree. Copies for XP are epic fail.
I will try this soon, and let you know if it works.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 7:04 pm 
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I have discovered a side effect of the theme engine transplant: MMCs either toss an error and then open fine, toss an error and then open with no content, or else don't open. I am thinking that whatever is causing this would be cured by replacing mmc.exe, but I haven't tried it yet.

I am currently working on solving the fugly context menu problem, and then I will move on to debugging any side effects (such as mmc).

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 4:49 am 
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Sorry, my english is bad.
But, i have a news....I get transpant uxtheme.dll from Longhorn 5048, longhorn reset, on server 2003...I am making a operating system modification, calling "Windows ShortHorn", running aero and others like features from longhorn/Vista with the speed of server 2003. Well, backing to longhorn theme engine, aero forum 5048 and luna running fine on server 2003..but, no mutch differences. A problem running aero on server 2003: "All programs" options and menu not display on start menu. I think what are new start menu on longhorn-vista..But, luna running without problems. I am try portirng longhorn dlls, but is difficult. I go programmer aero feturatures emulations for nunning naturally on Server 2003 and Xp, with maximum speed!!

Wait and see!!


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 9:05 pm 
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Share some details on how you did this, I was under the impression that post-3683 theming engines were incompatible (and they were, 3706->4011, in my testing).

If you get frustrated and want a quick fix to the start menu issue, you could use ViStart to replace the normal one - thus bypassing the problem and some new ones I could see cropping up regarding the search box.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:19 pm 
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Thank you very much for all this information :D


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:25 am 
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Well, i am again...
Make a test with uxtheme.dll from vista beta 1, server 2003 startup normally, but, aero theme is not load...I have a vista build 5219, make a test again, and server 2003 startup normally and aero load and apply...I think what windows 2003 is more compitable with longhorn files than windows xp...I am impressed with this, after, Windows Longhorn is based in windows XP..I talk longhorn pre and pos restet( build 3xxx - 4xxx and 5xxx) I go make more tests and talk here


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:06 pm 
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Samuka wrote:
Well, i am again...
Make a test with uxtheme.dll from vista beta 1, server 2003 startup normally, but, aero theme is not load...I have a vista build 5219, make a test again, and server 2003 startup normally and aero load and apply...I think what windows 2003 is more compitable with longhorn files than windows xp...I am impressed with this, after, Windows Longhorn is based in windows XP..I talk longhorn pre and pos restet( build 3xxx - 4xxx and 5xxx) I go make more tests and talk here


Give us some screenshots...

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 6:06 pm 
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Pwned wrote:
Give us some screenshots...


Ok, a go post some screenshots....But, some effects of themes not works in server 2003...I think what depends shell32.dll...Effects how "icon select effect", differents colors of shellstyle, and glow in buttons not work...Shell32.dll of longhorn not work too


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 6:38 pm 
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Well, the screenshots:
(I'm brasilian, the language is portuguese)
Aero working:
http://img101.imageshack.us/i/3213small.jpg/
And Aero start meu bug:
http://img297.imageshack.us/i/1smallg.jpg/
uxtheme version direct from Longhorn 5048 idx02:
http://img80.imageshack.us/i/434small.jpg/
And Uxtheme build lab
http://img513.imageshack.us/i/21small.jpg/
Luna Theme:
http://img18.imageshack.us/i/fdsmall.jpg/
Luna Start menu without bug:
http://img42.imageshack.us/i/232small.jpg/
And icon select effect not work, probably becouse shell32.dll not contain this effects.
http://img297.imageshack.us/i/3232k.jpg/


Last edited by hounsell on Thu Nov 12, 2009 8:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
Changed Images to Links, in future, please use the BA Image Uploader


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 7:55 pm 
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Cool. I'm working on getting Aero on Svr03 now.

You're supposed to use the Image Uploader here on BA though, someone will probably come and complain about that.

Edit:

Confirmed the "Firefox" glitch with the 3xxx themes. I use Seamonkey on my laptop and just did the theme transplant today. It rendered all context menus unusable. IE6 works fine though, and so does Iron/Chrome, so unless you're a diehard FF/Seamonkey fan it's a non-issue.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:31 pm 
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I want to run dwm from Longhorn 5048.....This is single build what DWM work with XPdriver and my radeon x1650..Longhorn 4xxx and vista beta 1 + with xpdriver same with hack not work...Maybe work with other VGA.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 2:42 am 
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Yushatak wrote:
Share some details on how you did this, I was under the impression that post-3683 theming engines were incompatible (and they were, 3706->4011, in my testing).



heres a little update for what its worth
i managed to port Longhorns 3706 (yes, the DCE dependant one) uxtheme engine to XP tonight ^^

Plex theme of 3706 loads normaly, but it still has context menu bugs
so problem must lie somewhere else

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 1:23 am 
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ok ported uxtheme from LH 3718 to XP
using 3718 Plex

context menu has NO bugs !!!

transplant sucsessful !!!

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 PostPost subject: Re: Longhorn 3718 Experiments        Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:07 am 
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Would you mind sharing how you did this? Plex looks awesome and I want it on my XP machine.

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