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 PostPost subject: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:50 pm 
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All support for Windows 7 was discontinued in January 14, 2020...
so it's time for Microsoft to start the development of a true successor to Windows 10 and restore its old company logo!

Some features nice to have in the true successor of Windows 10 would be:
  • Distributions on Blu-ray Disc.
  • Support for DVD and Blu-ray movies and audio-only discs out of the box.
  • The ability to edit the Alpha (transparency) layer in Paint.
  • The return of Offline Help and Classic Themes (both removed in Windows 8) and the Classic Start Menu (removed in Windows 7).


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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:24 pm 
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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:53 pm 
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winnt32 wrote:
what are you...?

Someone who wants a better future for Microsoft Windows, of course!


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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:59 pm 
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Ooookkkkaaaayyyy...

1. This is BetaArchive. Not the CLG wiki. Go over there if you want to melt down about logos.
2. Do you know how many people actually have a Blu-ray drive on their computer? I mean, I have one, but I'm part of a small minority. Most machines nowadays doesn't have ANY optical disc drive at all, let alone a Blu-ray drive. And even if most computers have a Blu-ray drive, what's the point if Windows 10 still fits onto a dual-layer DVD... at most?
3. If you really need to play some DVDs or Blu-rays, download VLC and install the AACS library. It's not that hard. MS doesn't want to bother paying for any licensing fees for the decoders needed for having DVD/BD support built in during a time when having the drive and media is getting more rare.
4. If you really need to edit transparency, download Paint.net... or Gimp... Paint has always been a mediocre program for this kind of stuff.
5. Offline help I can agree with, as it seems a bit stupid how if you try to open up help it'll just open up Edge and search for "Windows 10 Help" on Bing. But, there is still Bing or Google, which are infinitely more useful then Offline help ever was.
6. For the classic start menu and theme, not a whole lot of people cares, not enough for Microsoft to care, but there are plenty of third party tools to help you.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:09 am 
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Ooookkkkaaaayyyy...

1. This is BetaArchive. Not the CLG wiki. Go over there if you want to melt down about logos.
2. Do you know how many people actually have a Blu-ray drive on their computer? I mean, I have one, but I'm part of a small minority. Most machines nowadays doesn't have ANY optical disc drive at all, let alone a Blu-ray drive. And even if most computers have a Blu-ray drive, what's the point if Windows 10 still fits onto a dual-layer DVD... at most?
3. If you really need to play some DVDs or Blu-rays, download VLC and install the AACS library. It's not that hard. MS doesn't want to bother paying for any licensing fees for the decoders needed for having DVD/BD support built in during a time when having the drive and media is getting more rare.
4. If you really need to edit transparency, download Paint.net... or Gimp... Paint has always been a mediocre program for this kind of stuff.
5. Offline help I can agree with, as it seems a bit stupid how if you try to open up help it'll just open up Edge and search for "Windows 10 Help" on Bing. But, there is still Bing or Google, which are infinitely more useful then Offline help ever was.
6. For the classic start menu and theme, not a whole lot of people cares, not enough for Microsoft to care, but there are plenty of third party tools to help you.


I think more people should have BD-R drives. I have one but the SATA cable stopped working. Also, a more basic theme would be useful. Offline manuals would be good for me in the boonies, but that paint suggestion is indeed entirely stupid

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:20 am 
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I am of the view that none of this will happen. These suggestions are—no offense intended—foolish.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:25 am 
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Maza wrote:
I am of the view that none of this will happen. These suggestions are—no offense intended—foolish.
I'm not denying this

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:13 am 
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And ranting on a random forum will make that happen how exactly?

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:43 am 
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So you posted this word-for-word on Winworld, didn't get the response you wanted so you reposted here instead...?

1. Microsft wants to save that 50 cents per disc. When you account for the millions placed into circulation, that turns to a lot of money. Microsoft needs to save that money for their "Windows as a service" scheme. That and "modern" PCs don't have disc drives because everything is rearing to "the cloud" and it's simply cheaper to save that 10 bucks per drive or whatever bulk pallet cost OEMs could have gotten them for per unit. Even better, custom pc build cases are more and more designed without 5.25 bays.
2. It made sense when people desired physical copies and still used physical copies therefore justifying licensing costs. Again, everything is going "to the cloud" because physical media is such a burden so no. Not to mention Satya Nadella's great push for Windows to be all cloud, so not going to happen.
3. It is a limitation of paint itself. Despite being quite different on the surface it still can trace its original roots to paintbrush even today.
4. Not going to happen, so many people have to save that precious 500mb and Microsoft doesn't want to have to take the time to rewrite, recompile, and check help files especially with the rapidly changing Windows 10. Cheaper to just cookie cutter off a template something right onto the internet. Because you just can't have a computer without internet, right? Or even live without reliable high-speed high bandwidth connection. People who live without these couldn't possibly exist in this world.
5. Never going to happen. Especially with how Microsoft is continuing to make Windows more and more UWP and xaml based and trying hard (Nadella) to deprecate Win32. Oh and then factor all that time spent trying to scratch everything and make the new xaml start menu when a perfectly functional one was already made. Go find yourself a classic start program and stop wishing for something that'll never happen.

In fact, all of your ideas will never happen. And posting the same pipe dream copy-pasta'd word for word on many different forums won't change that.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:37 am 
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daemonspudguy wrote:
I think more people should have BD-R drives. I have one but the SATA cable stopped working. Also, a more basic theme would be useful. Offline manuals would be good for me in the boonies, but that paint suggestion is indeed entirely stupid


Blu Ray is totally outdated now. Unless you one of those few that are buying HD movies on disc, there is close to zero needs of having any optical disc drives. If your cable stops working, buy a new cable.

yourepicfailure wrote:
So you posted this word-for-word on Winworld, didn't get the response you wanted so you reposted here instead...?

1. Microsft wants to save that 50 cents per disc. When you account for the millions placed into circulation, that turns to a lot of money. Microsoft needs to save that money for their "Windows as a service" scheme. That and "modern" PCs don't have disc drives because everything is rearing to "the cloud" and it's simply cheaper to save that 10 bucks per drive or whatever bulk pallet cost OEMs could have gotten them for per unit. Even better, custom pc build cases are more and more designed without 5.25 bays.
2. It made sense when people desired physical copies and still used physical copies therefore justifying licensing costs. Again, everything is going "to the cloud" because physical media is such a burden so no. Not to mention Satya Nadella's great push for Windows to be all cloud, so not going to happen.
3. It is a limitation of paint itself. Despite being quite different on the surface it still can trace its original roots to paintbrush even today.
4. Not going to happen, so many people have to save that precious 500mb and Microsoft doesn't want to have to take the time to rewrite, recompile, and check help files especially with the rapidly changing Windows 10. Cheaper to just cookie cutter off a template something right onto the internet. Because you just can't have a computer without internet, right? Or even live without reliable high-speed high bandwidth connection. People who live without these couldn't possibly exist in this world.
5. Never going to happen. Especially with how Microsoft is continuing to make Windows more and more UWP and xaml based and trying hard (Nadella) to deprecate Win32. Oh and then factor all that time spent trying to scratch everything and make the new xaml start menu when a perfectly functional one was already made. Go find yourself a classic start program and stop wishing for something that'll never happen.

In fact, all of your ideas will never happen. And posting the same pipe dream copy-pasta'd word for word on many different forums won't change that.

Saving 50 cents per disc isn't the most important part. It cost more to distribute physical medias which usually ends up in landfills as releases are outdated 6 months later. MS went towards a much more environmentally friendly approach as OEM packages don't use necessary plastic anymore. Only less than 1% of the users would need a physical disc in the first world countries. They wouldn't be able to push out biannual releases if they have to keep producing discs. The chances are people will get all the different versions of Win10 mixed up.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:38 am 
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There is also not going to be a "true successor of Windows 10" in the vein of which you speak. This statement: "so it's time for Microsoft to start the development of a true successor to Windows 10 and restore its old company logo!" demonstrates naïveté.

It would be better for you to focus on legitimate improvements to Windows 10.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:48 am 
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ibmpcat5170 wrote:
All support for Windows 7 was discontinued in January 14, 2020...
so it's time for Microsoft to start the development of a true successor to Windows 10 and restore its old company logo!

Some features nice to have in the true successor of Windows 10 would be:
  • Distributions on Blu-ray Disc.
  • Support for DVD and Blu-ray movies and audio-only discs out of the box.
  • The ability to edit the Alpha (transparency) layer in Paint.
  • The return of Offline Help and Classic Themes (both removed in Windows 8) and the Classic Start Menu (removed in Windows 7).


OK so a 12 year old kid on a very niche forum obviously and clearly represents the market of Windows 10 customers.

- in a day and age where PCs ship without optical drives, why the [censored] would you spend more on pressing blu rays when digital distribution is way less expensive and USB less expensive than pressing a disc
- technically the support is there for the filesystem, but again few people watch movies on a PC. Those that do have a bluray drive tend to rip them and watch them on their 150" projector screen like me
- stop being poor and buy photoshop or illustrator
- not sure if stupid or what

And yes, Microsoft have just announced that they are rolling back to their old branding after spending millions on their current design strategy that also incorporates other products such as Surface and Xbox. 8-)

Technology moves on, and so should you.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:51 am 
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Windows 10 is a service. I highly doubt that there will be a new version for at least the next 10 years. I think that Microsoft will change the name of the operating system to just "Windows" and perhaps one day make it a square logo, but for now, I think "Windows 11" is out of the question. I think it's easier for "Doors" or "Windows/2" to one day be released.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:29 pm 
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XDude wrote:
Blu Ray is totally outdated now. Unless you one of those few that are buying HD movies on disc, there is close to zero needs of having any optical disc drives. If your cable stops working, buy a new cable
I live in the middle of BFE Ohio where Internet connections are expensive and untrustworthy. They are also not even close to outdated yet. If they were, Microsoft and Sony wouldn't be putting them in their upcoming consoles.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:32 pm 
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Bah, people already explained why most of your requests are unrealistic.

The logos, however, will change. Eventually.
It'll probably not happen any time soon, though, because brands need a certain stability.
The current Windows logo was introduced at the end of 2012 and I can see it last for a few years more, probably until some more significant evolution of Windows happens.
The current Microsoft logo will probably last far longer than that.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:33 pm 
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xelloss wrote:
Bah, people already explained why most of your requests are unrealistic.

The logos, however, will change. Eventually.
It'll probably not happen any time soon, though, because brands need a certain stability.
The current Windows logo was introduced at the end of 2012 and I can see it last for a few years more, probably until some more significant evolution of Windows happens.
The current Microsoft logo will probably last far longer than that.
I didn't start this. Also I said it wouldn't happen.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:48 pm 
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daemonspudguy wrote:
XDude wrote:
Blu Ray is totally outdated now. Unless you one of those few that are buying HD movies on disc, there is close to zero needs of having any optical disc drives. If your cable stops working, buy a new cable
I live in the middle of BFE Ohio where Internet connections are expensive and untrustworthy. They are also not even close to outdated yet. If they were, Microsoft and Sony wouldn't be putting them in their upcoming consoles.

I forgot, that must be why Microsoft don't sell USB drives?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Windows-10-Hom ... 0733314683

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 5:23 pm 
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Ok, first off...
ibmpcat5170 wrote:
All support for Windows 7 was discontinued in January 14, 2020...
Not all support. Apart from the obvious Extended Security Updates which end on 2023, Windows Thin PC has it's support end on October 12th, 2021, same with it's base, POSReady 7. Windows Embedded 7 lags behind by around one year, October 13th, 2020.
ibmpcat5170 wrote:
so it's time for Microsoft to start the development of a true successor to Windows 10 and restore its old company logo!
They will not do this, first off. Other than Windows 10 being declared the final, last version of Windows by Microsoft, it is very unlikely for them to go back from being flat, a trend that replaced the 3D look of everything around 2012/2013, back to how it was before.
ibmpcat5170 wrote:
Some features nice to have in the true successor of Windows 10 would be:
  • Distributions on Blu-ray Disc.
  • Support for DVD and Blu-ray movies and audio-only discs out of the box.
  • The ability to edit the Alpha (transparency) layer in Paint.
  • The return of Offline Help and Classic Themes (both removed in Windows 8) and the Classic Start Menu (removed in Windows 7).
1) Don't see the point of doing this. As, going to be brought up in my point
2) That depends on the disk drive of your computer, which is unlikely to include a Blu Ray drive unless you install it yourself. Then it should work without an issue.
3) That actually sounds like a neat idea. That was always a problem with MSPaint imo, no transparency. Simple free alternatives can even do it.
4) Offline help could actually be quite useful, and implemented into Windows 10. The classic theme/start menu is unlikely since as previously said, it won't fit the theme that Microsoft is trying to achieve with Windows 10. There are ways to achieve this with third party applications.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 7:45 pm 
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Level69chad wrote:
daemonspudguy wrote:
XDude wrote:
Blu Ray is totally outdated now. Unless you one of those few that are buying HD movies on disc, there is close to zero needs of having any optical disc drives. If your cable stops working, buy a new cable
I live in the middle of BFE Ohio where Internet connections are expensive and untrustworthy. They are also not even close to outdated yet. If they were, Microsoft and Sony wouldn't be putting them in their upcoming consoles.

I forgot, that must be why Microsoft don't sell USB drives?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Windows-10-Hom ... 0733314683
Jeeze [censored]. I was countering his claim that BluRays are useless based on his movie argument

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:15 pm 
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Level69chad wrote:
I forgot, that must be why Microsoft don't sell USB drives?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Windows-10-Hom ... 0733314683

A pointlessly snide reply. The point is a very good one, however.
daemonspudguy wrote:
Jeeze [censored]. I was countering his claim that BluRays are useless based on his movie argument

It was then not your intent to imply that Blu-Ray is not outdated?

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:28 pm 
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That was my intent.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Windows 10 and Microsoft's New Logo are NO GOOD!        Posted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 2:34 am 
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I think this thread has run its course as people can't stay away from name calling and going offtopic.

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