Windows NT 3.51 CD Boot Problems

Post by **Kenneth** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 2:47 pm

Can anyone help me resolve this problem?

When I add the NT Boot Sector and Tag files, I always get a ntdetect failed message when I boot it up.

Post by **empireum** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 2:50 pm

It could be because NT 3.51 has never been distributed on a bootable CD, so maybe the loader and ntdetect don't support that. Which boot sector are you using, I presume an NT4 or newer one? Try to put the matching loader (either ntldr or setupldr) and ntdetect.com files in as well. I had the same issue when trying to make an ISO of Windows 2000 build 2124 bootable with either a build 2128 or 2195 boot sector, none worked, all gave that error message.

Post by **Namronia** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 3:24 pm

Install it from DOS or Windows 95, itll work

Post by **Kenneth** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 3:30 pm

Boots... But the Stop Error comes up.

Code: Select all

1 System Processor [65600 Kb Memory] MultiProcessor Kernel                     
                                                                               
*** STOP: 0x0000006B (0xC000003A,0x00000002,0x00000000,0x00000000)             
PROCESS1_INITIALIZATION_FAILED                                                 
                                                                               
CPUID:GenuineIntel 7.4.7 irql:0  SYSVER 0xf0000421                             
                                                                               
Dll Base DateStmp - Name               Dll Base DateStmp - Name                
80100000 2fc653e6 - ntoskrnl.exe       80400000 2fb24f4a - hal.dll             
803ae000 2fb65b8e - setupdd.sys        80001000 2fc27bf5 - pcmcia.sys          
80008000 2faae8ca - SCSIPORT.SYS       80065000 2faae85e - cpqarray.sys        
803e0000 2faae860 - delldsa.sys        803e2000 2faae86a - ncr53c9x.sys        
803e5000 2faae86d - spock.sys          803e7000 2faae86b - oliscsi.sys         
803eb000 2faae87d - ncrc700.sys        801bf000 2fb035a7 - ncrc710.sys         
801c2000 2faae853 - aha154x.sys        801c5000 2faae879 - sparrow.sys         
803ee000 2faae856 - aha174x.sys        801ca000 2faae861 - dptscsi.sys         
801cd000 2faae872 - ultra14f.sys       801cf000 2faae874 - ultra124.sys        
801d1000 2faae875 - ultra24f.sys       801d2000 2faae85b - ami0nt.sys          
801d4000 2faae877 - fd7000ex.sys       801d6000 2faae864 - fd8xx.sys           
801d9000 2faae863 - fd16_700.sys       801dc000 2faae86f - t128.sys            
801df000 2faae870 - t13b.sys           801e2000 2faae858 - always.sys          
801e8000 2faae87c - arrow.sys          801f1000 2faae862 - dtc329x.sys         
801f3000 2fc28575 - atapi.sys          801f6000 2faae87f - ncrc810.sys         
801f9000 2faae871 - tmv1.sys           801fc000 2faae85d - buslogic.sys        
801fe000 2faae880 - slcd32.sys         80205000 2faae87b - aic78xx.sys         
8020b000 2faae868 - dac960nt.sys       8020d000 2fb2872f - ql10wnt.sys         
80214000 2faae859 - amsint.sys         80217000 2faae8b0 - atdisk.sys          
8021d000 2faae89f - abiosdsk.sys       80220000 2fc15d19 - fastfat.sys         
8023f000 2faae8ec - pinball.sys        8025b000 2fc4f4b2 - ntfs.sys            
802aa000 2faae892 - vga.sys            802ae000 2faae88d - VIDEOPRT.SYS        
802b2000 00000000 - floppy.sys         802b7000 2fb16eef - scsicdrm.sys        
802bb000 2faae8c7 - scsiflop.sys       802bf000 2faae8c5 - scsidisk.sys        
802c4000 2faae8b2 - i8042prt.sys       802ca000 2faae8b4 - kbdclass.sys        
802cd000 2faae965 - cdfs.sys                                                   
                                                                               
Address  dword dump   Build [1057]                           - Name            
fcb6e9f8 80188a01 80188a01 00000202 80132f34 fcb6ea20 00000000 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6ea00 80132f34 80132f34 fcb6ea20 00000000 8017855c fcd68ce8 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6ea0c 8017855c 8017855c fcd68ce8 803f50e8 00000000 00000000 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6eabc 801545df 801545df fcb6ebd0 00000000 b6eadc00 00000000 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6eb1c 8010e42c 8010e42c 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000207 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6eb58 80136764 80136764 80100c70 ffffffff fcb6eba4 80159f0e - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6eb5c 80100c70 80100c70 ffffffff fcb6eba4 80159f0e fcb6ec10 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6eb68 80159f0e 80159f0e fcb6ec10 00100001 fcb6ebd0 fcb6ebe8 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6eba8 801af775 801af775 fcb6ec10 00100001 fcb6ebd0 fcb6ebe8 - ntoskrnl.exe  
fcb6ebf4 801af57a 801af57a 00000018 00000000 fcb6ec18 00000040 - ntoskrnl.exe  
                                                                               
Restart and set the recovery options in the system control panel               
or the /CRASHDEBUG system start option. If this message reappears,

Post by **empireum** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 4:03 pm

Namronia wrote:Install it from DOS or Windows 95, itll work

He probably knows that, but this was not the question.

Post by **Kenneth** » Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:54 pm

I do know about it.

Post by **Namronia** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 1:58 am

Then im sorry, i only wanted to help

Post by **Unknown** » Mon Nov 05, 2007 3:13 am

If I remember correctly, someone made a bootable iso of daytona back in the osba days, is that here on
any of the servers, perhaps you can check on how it was made bootable.

Post by **Namronia** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:00 am

i think "they" took the IMA file of the first floppy and put it onto the cd bootable with somekind of "ultraiso" or something like that

Post by **mdogg** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:28 am

That wouldn't work because the boot floppies made in the NT 3.51 setup expect that all the files from the DOS portion of the setup to already be there. To make it bootable, you could add a DOS floppy and in the autoexec.bat run the setup after loading a few CD drivers.

Post by **ppc_digger** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:34 am

mdogg wrote:That wouldn't work because the boot floppies made in the NT 3.51 setup expect that all the files from the DOS portion of the setup to already be there. To make it bootable, you could add a DOS floppy and in the autoexec.bat run the setup after loading a few CD drivers.

That won't work. The DOS part expects you to create three floppies, and A: will be an emulated read-only floppy. The only way I see something like this working is somehow using memdisk to emulate a hard drive, and writing an NT driver to read it while in protected mode (as memdisk only traps BIOS calls).

Post by **Rob Jansen** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 10:31 am

I have installed NT 3.51 in VPC.

I use a CD with the files with the windows 95 bootdisk the was writen to the CD as boot.

And run winnt /? to look at witch switch uses the no boot floppy's (problably /x). That write the bootsector the HD.

And the NT 3.51 Setup fails on a pentium 4.
There is some trick to make it work.
I have to find the document were its in and the modified files.

Post by **empireum** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 10:40 am

ppc_digger wrote:
mdogg wrote:That wouldn't work because the boot floppies made in the NT 3.51 setup expect that all the files from the DOS portion of the setup to already be there. To make it bootable, you could add a DOS floppy and in the autoexec.bat run the setup after loading a few CD drivers.
That won't work. The DOS part expects you to create three floppies, and A: will be an emulated read-only floppy. The only way I see something like this working is somehow using memdisk to emulate a hard drive, and writing an NT driver to read it while in protected mode (as memdisk only traps BIOS calls).

It'll work if you use a DOS boot disk as the boot image file and then have autoexec.bat or whatever call winnt /b to copy the necessary files to a bootable FAT16 partition on the HD and eliminate the need for the floppies; using that approach, you'll be running Setup from the HD, not from the CD though.

Post by **jaclaz** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 7:58 am

There was a thread some time ago on 911CD forum related to this:
http://www.911cd.net/forums//index.php?showtopic=19948
(that was not finalized) maybe you can get some ideas from it.

You might also need to "update" the OS to install on newer CPU's or use larger HD's:
http://www.geocities.com/bearwindows/winnt351.htm
http://alter.org.ua/en/soft/nt_spack/nt3/

jaclaz

Post by **Kenneth** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 12:06 pm

No, I just get the stop error when I boot

Post by **ppc_digger** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 6:32 pm

empireum wrote:
ppc_digger wrote:
mdogg wrote:That wouldn't work because the boot floppies made in the NT 3.51 setup expect that all the files from the DOS portion of the setup to already be there. To make it bootable, you could add a DOS floppy and in the autoexec.bat run the setup after loading a few CD drivers.
That won't work. The DOS part expects you to create three floppies, and A: will be an emulated read-only floppy. The only way I see something like this working is somehow using memdisk to emulate a hard drive, and writing an NT driver to read it while in protected mode (as memdisk only traps BIOS calls).
It'll work if you use a DOS boot disk as the boot image file and then have autoexec.bat or whatever call winnt /b to copy the necessary files to a bootable FAT16 partition on the HD and eliminate the need for the floppies; using that approach, you'll be running Setup from the HD, not from the CD though.

I didn't know about that switch, thanks. It should be possible to copy those files to a CD, then add a few CD-ROM drivers and an NT 4/5 loader (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Post by **jaclaz** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 4:21 pm

I just tried the following (using the three floppy disks) I simply used Winimage to expand first one to 2,88 Mb, then copied SOME of the files of the other bootdisks and deleted SOME others.
Final result was this:

Il volume nell'unit… J Š NTWKS35A_01
Numero di serie del volume: 0CEA-183D

Directory di J:\

26/05/1995 10.57 0 DISK101
26/05/1995 10.57 6.432 KBDUS.DLL
26/05/1995 10.57 12.288 SETUPREG.HIV
12/11/2007 20.16 <DIR> SYSTEM32
26/05/1995 10.57 330.352 NTFS.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 143.712 SETUPLDR.BIN
26/05/1995 10.57 816.592 NTKRNLMP.EXE
26/05/1995 10.57 47.376 HAL486C.DLL
26/05/1995 10.57 5.168 VGAOEM.FON
26/05/1995 10.57 15.040 VGA.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 26.640 NTDETECT.COM
26/05/1995 10.57 66.082 C_1252.NLS
26/05/1995 10.57 18.928 FLOPPY.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 130.448 FASTFAT.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 214.272 SETUPDD.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 17.360 VIDEOPRT.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 9.456 KBDCLASS.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 7.142 L_INTL.NLS
26/05/1995 10.57 66.594 C_437.NLS
26/05/1995 10.57 27.104 PCMCIA.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 23.984 I8042PRT.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 12.256 ATAPI.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 24.336 ATDISK.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 47.984 CDFS.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 81.115 TXTSETUP.SIF
26/05/1995 10.57 0 DISK102
26/05/1995 10.57 0 DISK103
26/05/1995 10.57 10.032 ABIOSDSK.SYS
26/05/1995 10.57 33.104 SCSIPORT.SYS
28 File 2.193.797 byte

Directory di J:\SYSTEM32

12/11/2007 20.16 <DIR> .
12/11/2007 20.16 <DIR> ..
26/05/1995 10.57 307.088 NTDLL.DLL
26/05/1995 10.57 87.936 SMSS.EXE
2 File 395.024 byte

Totale file elencati:
30 File 2.588.821 byte
3 Directory 328.704 byte disponibili

Basically I deleted all SCSI drivers that won't be used.
This 2.88 floppy boots allright in Qemu, thus it should also work when used as an El-Torito emulation image in a .iso.

I cannot say whether it would work on a "real" machine due to missing drivers, as said before one has to try and if needed check the bearwindows page I linked before.

jaclaz

Post by **KenOath** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 11:58 pm

Unknown wrote:If I remember correctly, someone made a bootable iso of daytona back in the osba days, is that here on
any of the servers, perhaps you can check on how it was made bootable.

Namronia wrote:i think "they" took the IMA file of the first floppy and put it onto the cd bootable with somekind of "ultraiso" or something like that

That was me that made the full ISO of Daytona 756 bootable...
I made my own bootdisk using an IBM dos bootdisk, from memory, using
any MS-Dos version just gave errors of some sort whereas the IBM Dos
didn't, I think it had something to do with memory managers or the like
when attempting to install using the winnt /b command, but that just may
have been a problem relating to that build anyhow...
If you'd like I could extract the bootable image I made from the ISO &
post a D/L link here for it...
If it worked on a beta I'd imagine it to work on a retail..!

Post by **Kenneth** » Sun Oct 19, 2008 7:19 pm

Extremely large bump, I know.

I have got it to successfully install now through CD Boot! I have used 2.88MB Floppy Emulation to do the trick. The only limitation is that it can only see the "IDE/ESDI Disks, BusLogic Disks and Sony CD-ROM Drives (WormSony)".

Code: Select all

1 System Processor [65600 Kb Memory] MultiProcessor Kernel                     
                                                                               
*** STOP: 0x0000006B (0xC000003A,0x00000002,0x00000000,0x00000000)             
PROCESS1_INITIALIZATION_FAILED                                                 
                                                                               
CPUID:GenuineIntel 7.4.7 irql:0  SYSVER 0xf0000421                             
                                                                               
Dll Base DateStmp - Name               Dll Base DateStmp - Name               
80100000 2fc653e6 - ntoskrnl.exe       80400000 2fb24f4a - hal.dll             
803ae000 2fb65b8e - setupdd.sys        80001000 2fc27bf5 - pcmcia.sys         
80008000 2faae8ca - SCSIPORT.SYS       80065000 2faae85e - cpqarray.sys       
803e0000 2faae860 - delldsa.sys        803e2000 2faae86a - ncr53c9x.sys       
803e5000 2faae86d - spock.sys          803e7000 2faae86b - oliscsi.sys         
803eb000 2faae87d - ncrc700.sys        801bf000 2fb035a7 - ncrc710.sys         
801c2000 2faae853 - aha154x.sys        801c5000 2faae879 - sparrow.sys         
803ee000 2faae856 - aha174x.sys        801ca000 2faae861 - dptscsi.sys         
801cd000 2faae872 - ultra14f.sys       801cf000 2faae874 - ultra124.sys       
801d1000 2faae875 - ultra24f.sys       801d2000 2faae85b - ami0nt.sys         
801d4000 2faae877 - fd7000ex.sys       801d6000 2faae864 - fd8xx.sys           
801d9000 2faae863 - fd16_700.sys       801dc000 2faae86f - t128.sys           
801df000 2faae870 - t13b.sys           801e2000 2faae858 - always.sys         
801e8000 2faae87c - arrow.sys          801f1000 2faae862 - dtc329x.sys         
801f3000 2fc28575 - atapi.sys          801f6000 2faae87f - ncrc810.sys         
801f9000 2faae871 - tmv1.sys           801fc000 2faae85d - buslogic.sys       
801fe000 2faae880 - slcd32.sys         80205000 2faae87b - aic78xx.sys         
8020b000 2faae868 - dac960nt.sys       8020d000 2fb2872f - ql10wnt.sys         
80214000 2faae859 - amsint.sys         80217000 2faae8b0 - atdisk.sys         
8021d000 2faae89f - abiosdsk.sys       80220000 2fc15d19 - fastfat.sys         
8023f000 2faae8ec - pinball.sys        8025b000 2fc4f4b2 - ntfs.sys           
802aa000 2faae892 - vga.sys            802ae000 2faae88d - VIDEOPRT.SYS       
802b2000 00000000 - floppy.sys         802b7000 2fb16eef - scsicdrm.sys       
802bb000 2faae8c7 - scsiflop.sys       802bf000 2faae8c5 - scsidisk.sys       
802c4000 2faae8b2 - i8042prt.sys       802ca000 2faae8b4 - kbdclass.sys       
802cd000 2faae965 - cdfs.sys                                                   
                                                                               
Address  dword dump   Build [1057]                           - Name           
fcb6e9f8 80188a01 80188a01 00000202 80132f34 fcb6ea20 00000000 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6ea00 80132f34 80132f34 fcb6ea20 00000000 8017855c fcd68ce8 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6ea0c 8017855c 8017855c fcd68ce8 803f50e8 00000000 00000000 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6eabc 801545df 801545df fcb6ebd0 00000000 b6eadc00 00000000 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6eb1c 8010e42c 8010e42c 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000207 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6eb58 80136764 80136764 80100c70 ffffffff fcb6eba4 80159f0e - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6eb5c 80100c70 80100c70 ffffffff fcb6eba4 80159f0e fcb6ec10 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6eb68 80159f0e 80159f0e fcb6ec10 00100001 fcb6ebd0 fcb6ebe8 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6eba8 801af775 801af775 fcb6ec10 00100001 fcb6ebd0 fcb6ebe8 - ntoskrnl.exe 
fcb6ebf4 801af57a 801af57a 00000018 00000000 fcb6ec18 00000040 - ntoskrnl.exe 
                                                                               
Restart and set the recovery options in the system control panel               
or the /CRASHDEBUG system start option. If this message reappears,

The cause of this stop error is that the Kernel cannot find the native application it needs, SMSS.exe or the User Mode System DLL (NtDLL).

The Windows XP Equivalent of the error message:

Code: Select all

STOP: c0000221
Unknown hard error.
\SystemRoot\System32\ntdll.dll
cannot be found.

The thing that troubled me for some time was the GUI Setup. It also needed several tag files, specifically, disk101-disk103, disk1.w-disk32.w. It gives a non fatal error about CPPInstall, errno 5.

The ISO is uploaded to the BA FTP.

Enjoy! It has SP5 integrated, even though NT does not say it.

Post by **jaclaz** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:13 am

Should this be of any use, it has been recently found how you can have bigger than 2.88 Mb floppy image in the El-Torito floppy emulation image.
Details are here:
http://www.msfn.org/board/topic/152399- ... emulation/
Basically you can have a superfloppy as big as:
0x03: 1024*2*36 * 512 = 37,748,736
0x02: 1024*2*18 * 512 = 18,874,368
0x01: 1024*2*15 * 512 = 15,728,640
This would allow to have the "full" set of floppies.

jaclaz

Windows NT 3.51 CD Boot Problems

Windows NT 3.51 CD Boot Problems

Re: Windows NT 3.51 CD Boot Problems