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 PostPost subject: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:26 am 
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Im making a insanely long RSA-bit SSL certificate (I think at least 100,000 bits)

Im just wondering how much harder it is to crack a, lets say a 90,000 bit certificate, versus a regular 2048, 4096, or 8192 but certificate? :wink:

Im testing my own certificate's security, not for illegal purposes.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:06 am 
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Isn't it practically impossible to crack even a 2048-bit RSA key? It's going to take forever to even create a 100,000-bit key. If you're really paranoid just use an 8192-bit key and you'll probably not have to worry about it until quantum computers come around.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:00 pm 
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QuiescentWonder wrote:
Isn't it practically impossible to crack even a 2048-bit RSA key? It's going to take forever to even create a 100,000-bit key. If you're really paranoid just use an 8192-bit key and you'll probably not have to worry about it until quantum computers come around.


But a 100,000 bit one is way harder to crack - I just want to know the probability or time it'd take.

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Last edited by motherboardlove on Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:07 pm 
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motherboardlove wrote:
QuiescentWonder wrote:
Isn't it practically impossible to crack even a 2048-bit RSA key? It's going to take forever to even create a 100,000-bit key. If you're really paranoid just use an 8192-bit key and you'll probably not have to worry about it until quantum computers come around.

Nice quoting skills.

If I may, might I divert your attention over here - viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8369&start=25 - we're eagerly awaiting a reply.

Thankyou.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:46 pm 
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So far, you have enlightened us with these wonderful posts stating

1) You have a HOUSE full of servers
2) You claim you have software on isohunt - whats it called?
3) You want to make a 100,000+ bit encryption certificate

wtf, even Andy can agree that you are full of it and that a ban probably is imminent

And fyi, it'll take forever for a 100,000 bit encryption certificate. And unless you're doing the Queens banking, there is no reason why youd need this much security. Ever.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:49 pm 
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happy dude wrote:
So far, you have enlightened us with these wonderful posts stating

1) You have a HOUSE full of servers
2) You claim you have software on isohunt - whats it called?
3) You want to make a 100,000+ bit encryption certificate

wtf, even Andy can agree that you are full of it and that a ban probably is imminent

And fyi, it'll take forever for a 100,000 bit encryption certificate. And unless you're doing the Queens banking, there is no reason why youd need this much security. Ever.

Don't forget that his legal expertise stretches to advising someone to take someone else to court over 50USD.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:25 pm 
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ATTN mods are we really going to set the precedence that if a mob gangs up on a forums user he should be banned? Sure his posts may be a bit weird at times, but no more than the average BA poster, who among us here did not make the odd post asking about stupid things when they were new?

Does this forums have any rules regarding sexual discrimination, I feel the plight of motherboard lovers has gone on for far too long, are you really any better than fascist police beating up members of a gay pride parade?

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How long will the plight of sexual discrimination ravage this once beautiful accepting forum, I say let he who is without sin cast the first stone! And someone please put a stop to all the off-topic posting in this thread, please.

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Last edited by longview on Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:33 pm 
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Why is everyone so friggin' paranoid and obsessed in being oh so so so so secure oh I must get a 100k ssh certificate oh i must only chat to people in in using Otr?2 encryption...

Ajdesign already winds me up with this, mbl you're just being obsessive

no matter how secure your computer is it won't stop me coming over there and destroying it to bits - *the ultimate way to stop anyone from hacking your data*


HAPPY?

Rant over

also Longview since when did I see a green tag on your username

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:44 pm 
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happy dude wrote:
So far, you have enlightened us with these wonderful posts stating

1) You have a HOUSE full of servers
2) You claim you have software on isohunt - whats it called?
3) You want to make a 100,000+ bit encryption certificate

wtf, even Andy can agree that you are full of it and that a ban probably is imminent

And fyi, it'll take forever for a 100,000 bit encryption certificate. And unless you're doing the Queens banking, there is no reason why youd need this much security. Ever.


1) Ok? Its a small house, as I previously mentioned
2) It was removed, after taking legal action. It was custom software, apparently leaked by an employee.
3) So? Im paranoid? Is there a problem with how many bits my SSL certificate is? Is there a rule saying "Please do not discuss SSL certificates over 4096 bits"?

FYI) Im running it in my friend's cluster. :evil:

hougtimo wrote:
Don't forget that his legal expertise stretches to advising someone to take someone else to court over 50USD.


50USD that could cause a FIRE and millions of dollars worth of property damage, possible.

Offtopic Comment
Thank you, longview.


Will a moderator or administrator please lock this topic - I think its becoming a flame war.

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Last edited by motherboardlove on Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:56 pm 
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motherboardlove wrote:
happy dude wrote:
So far, you have enlightened us with these wonderful posts stating

1) You have a HOUSE full of servers
2) You claim you have software on isohunt - whats it called?
3) You want to make a 100,000+ bit encryption certificate

wtf, even Andy can agree that you are full of it and that a ban probably is imminent

And fyi, it'll take forever for a 100,000 bit encryption certificate. And unless you're doing the Queens banking, there is no reason why youd need this much security. Ever.


1) Ok? Its a small house, as I previously mentioned
2) It was removed, after taking legal action. It was custom software, apparently leaked by an employee.
3) So? Im paranoid? Is there a problem with how many bits my SSL certificate is? Is there a rule saying "Please do not discuss SSL certificates over 4096 bits"?

hougtimo wrote:
Don't forget that his legal expertise stretches to advising someone to take someone else to court over 50USD.


50USD that could cause a FIRE and millions of dollars worth of property damage, possible.

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Thank you, longview.

Once again, Sir, you fail in grand style.

1) For someone who can't afford to pay some staff a bit of overtime, have you ever considered what your overheads running a house full of servers would be? it would work out much cheaper to have them hosted in a datacentre.

2) Again, what was the software? (And don't answer "it was a custom software" - that's possibly your most overused phrase)

3) No, but there should be.

4) If it caused a fire that would be the time to take legal action against the manufacturer.

Perhaps you could show us your company's website? Even if it is in (insert random far eastern language here).

Sorry, but you have all the traits of a compulsive liar... I believe "Motherboardlove" to be a fictional "internet character". I should know, when I was younger, I did exactly what you're doing now.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:06 pm 
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Enough. motherboardlove wanted to know how much time it theoretically would take to crack a 100000bit key. If you don't have anything valuable to add, then don't post. You can flame each other in PMs.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:29 pm 
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A quick Google would reveal an answer to you, MBL.

http://www.inet2000.com/public/encryption.htm

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:45 pm 
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Alpha-Critik wrote:
A quick Google would reveal an answer to you, MBL.

http://www.inet2000.com/public/encryption.htm


Thanks, but Ive seen that page, but I also want to know the speeds of a brute force attack eg, 300,000 tries /min, and at 4096 bits = 1 year (this is an example number, and is probably not accurate)

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:08 pm 
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longview wrote:
ATTN mods are we really going to set the precedence that if a mob gangs up on a forums user he should be banned? Sure his posts may be a bit weird at times, but no more than the average BA poster, who among us here did not make the odd post asking about stupid things when they were new?

Does this forums have any rules regarding sexual discrimination, I feel the plight of motherboard lovers has gone on for far too long, are you really any better than fascist police beating up members of a gay pride parade?

Image

How long will the plight of sexual discrimination ravage this once beautiful accepting forum, I say let he who is without sin cast the first stone! And someone please put a stop to all the off-topic posting in this thread, please.

That post was absolutely hysterical. You sir, just made my day.
And yeah, it'd take a pretty long time to crack it, but it's a waste of time doing it, to be honest.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:23 pm 
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Maybe this helps, motherboardlove: http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rnc1/brute.html

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 2:31 am 
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You must have read the notation incorrectly. With my quick math, at 3k tries per second, it would take a countlessly large number of millennium to bruteforce a 4096-bit key if you were trying every combination. A quick search turns this up: http://news.alibaba.com/article/detail/ ... lator.html

Which states that: By all known methods, a million pcs would take more than a hundred years to decode a single number scrambled with an RSA encryption using a 4,096-bit key.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 2:49 am 
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I can't understand why are we still discussing this...?


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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 3:34 am 
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Daniel wrote:
Maybe this helps, motherboardlove: http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rnc1/brute.html


Thanks, that cleared things up a bit...

After reading some of helpful posts (and some not so helpful ones) I decided to use a smaller bit encryption (32,768-bit)

Also, just had one little question...

Im running Apache, and I used the httpd-ssl.conf file to Use my SSL certificate. Anyways, I open the certificate in explorer (E:\Apache\cond\ssl.crt\server.crt) it shows the correct number of bits. However, when opened using right click in IE, (https://alpc.no-ip.biz), it says 1024-bit... Does anyone know why this is, and how to find the correct amount of bits? ;)

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:37 am 
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What you don't understand and what that page doesn't happen to mention (but which is mentioned on other pages which have been posted here) is that the number of possible keys grows exponentially. For example, here are the possible number of keys for each x-bit:

2-bit = 2^2 = 4
4-bit = 2^2^2^2 = 16
6-bit = 2^2^2^2^2^2 = 64
8-bit = 2^2^2^2^2^2^2^2 = 256
16-bit = 2^16 = 65,536
32-bit = 2^32 = 4,294,967,296 <-- Hey, check it out, 4 Gigabytes
64-bit = 2^64 = 18,446,744,073,709,551,616 <-- Check this out, 16 Exabytes

4096-bit key = 1.0443888814131525066917527107166e+1233

In other words, you need to move the decimal place 1,233 times to the right. So 10443888814131525066917527107166 with one-thousand, two-hundred and two zeros added on. They wouldn't be zeros but the calculator that comes with Windows isn't that precise. So if you go with 4096-bit, that is the number of possible keys.

That's why we're all telling you that using a 32,768-bit key is fracking absurd.


Last edited by QuiescentWonder on Thu Jul 23, 2009 7:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:14 am 
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xampp isnt meant for production use, its meant for localhost testing only, as its not secure.

Also,
I checked COX's AUP. Apparently you're not allowed to host servers. So sad.

Quote:
5. Servers. You may not operate, or allow others to operate, servers of any type or any other device, equipment, and/or software providing server-like functionality in connection with the Service, unless expressly authorized by Cox.

from http://ww2.cox.com/aboutus/policies.cox ... _Agreement


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Hmm.... Im gonna start up a website.... but....
The server's OSes are gonna be beta, so I dont have to pay..... lol
Naww... just kidding.

I wonder what OS BA's Servers run.....

I have a non-pirated version of Windows Server 2003 VL... Got it from MSDN....

How do you like.... register with a DNS Server...? :|

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=5948

Methinks motherboardlove isn't who he says.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:36 pm 
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Im mostly a software developer, and please look at the dates.

I have a business plan...

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 PostPost subject: Re: Cracking an SSL certificate...        Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 12:38 pm 
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Locked to avoid further flaming.

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