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 PostPost subject: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:00 pm 
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Apple is announcing new MacBooks, new iPhones and its next generation OS, Snow Leopard today but during its Keynote at WWDC they dug hard at Microsoft.

Bertrand Serlet, Senior Vice President of Software Engineering at Apple, took the stage and began digging at Vista saying "what a big hole Microsoft has dug," and adding that "they're trying to get out of it with Windows
7." He carried on following up with an attack of Windows 7 saying it has "even more complexity" than Vista because it's just based on the "same old tech as Vista."

Apple is notorious for attacking Windows based PCs in its Get A Mac adverts.

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Apple, are you running scare of Windows 7?

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:06 pm 
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Honestly, I'm sick of Apple's fanboyism. Windows is Windows. Vista is Vista. They're only exaggerating problems that don't exist anymore.

Here's one:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.

Quote:
He carried on following up with an attack of Windows 7 saying it has "even more complexity" than Vista because it's just based on the "same old tech as Vista."

Tech that is light years ahead of XP. In fact, it's faster than Vista.


Last edited by Kenneth on Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:15 pm 
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Apple, bashing Microsoft for fixing mistakes in their products by releasing a new version? Now I've heard everything!

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:20 pm 
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This infuriates me to no end. I've seen this topic plastered all over the internet, especially /g/. It's pathetic calling an OS something it isn't. It seems Apple exist just to bad-mouth Microsoft.

And in response, what do Microsoft do? They just let it fly. Which is why I shall never buy anything from Apple.

EDIT: And why I shall continue to purchase from Microsoft until someone better appears. *cough*

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Last edited by Alpha-Critik on Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:21 pm 
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Its a good point though, Windows 7 is pretty much Vista, which would be fine if we weren't expected to pay for it.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:58 pm 
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Except that it's different. I guess Windows 98 should have been free considering it was built on top of Windows 95 and that Windows XP should have been free to Windows 2000 users. Every version of Windows has been built on top of the codebase of an older version of Windows. I guess that means that Snow Leopard should be free, especially considering it doesn't really have any new features at all.

Microsoft, building on the same OS that had some problems at launch three years ago.

It's easy to use the same tactics against Apple, we can probably make it look a little worse.

This new version of OS X is just the same as the original 10.0 release. It still isn't going to run well on your 700MHz G3... actually now it won't run on any Apple machines made prior to 2006. The move from PPC to x86 caused all sorts of problems for everyone...

Apple, building on the same OS that had some problems at launch eight years ago, and then again, and again, and again...

Maddox does a good job of summing up my opinion of the subject (Warning, NSFW!): http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net ... =macs_cant

Besides, you can always just look at how Apple has <5% marketshare, and it's like that no matter how try to organize the numbers. The only place they dominate and don't need to try to create fanboys is with the iPod/iPhone. I'm looking forward to getting a 64GB iPod Touch myself.

Computers I use that aren't made by Apple, they just work.


Last edited by QuiescentWonder on Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:10 pm 
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It's not that different. At best you could honestly describe Windows 7 as Vista optimized, nothing more. People will generally take things at face value (before anything), and Windows 7 is not different enough on the surface to distinguish it from Vista, It seems to have been left to the masses who have tried it to pass the word along that it is actually different enough than Vista to warrant a look. Windows 7 might help to start to dig Microsoft out of the hole left by Vista but it certainly will not get them out of it, Windows 7 is simply not radical enough to achieve that feat. My personal view, it's boring and uninspiring.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:58 pm 
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Just because someone at Apple PR decided that there was a hole doesn't mean there is one. Go out and try to buy a computer without Windows Vista right now, one that isn't an overpriced Apple or a tiny netbook.

How about this list, which doesn't necessarily outline changes, but just new features: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_7

Here is a list of changes in Snow Leopard: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_v10.6
How about a list of features new to Leopard: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_1 ... d_features


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:31 am 
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Windows OCManage wrote:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.


I would have to disagree with you on the Memory hog thing. Honestly Vista is taking 1.3 GB of my Ram and Mac OS X is taking 340 MB of my ram on my OLD G3! :x :x :x

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:50 am 
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Windows Vista and Windows 7, certainly, are not perfect, but be assure, Windows 7 is much better overall than Windows Vista.

Mac OS X is no where certainly close to perfect either. It is no where as good as people assume it to be. I used to think that Mac OS X is much better than Windows until I actually tried it. Anyone else?

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:57 am 
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Blizzardo1 wrote:
Windows OCManage wrote:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.


I would have to disagree with you on the Memory hog thing. Honestly Vista is taking 1.3 GB of my Ram and Mac OS X is taking 340 MB of my ram on my OLD G3! :x :x :x


Vista takes every Mb of my 6Gb in my desktop.
That is a good thing. Unused RAM is wasted RAM. Vista's caching system really does make a huge difference, it really benefits a system

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:57 am 
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QuiescentWonder wrote:
Just because someone at Apple PR decided that there was a hole doesn't mean there is one. Go out and try to buy a computer without Windows Vista right now, one that isn't an overpriced Apple or a tiny netbook.


Um, what Apple's PR bleet on about is of little relevence. Vista created a hole, anyone who's paid attention in the last 2 1/2 years would be well aware of that fact. Both Apple and Linux have gained ground while Windows sales have suffered, more than in any previous years, and the sole reason for that is Vista. People did not want it plain and simple.

Just because most new PC's come with Vista proves nothing, because we all know how Microsoft works when it comes to retailing (the "it's this or nothing" approach), it certainly doesn't mean people want or like Vista, only that they are lumped with it until they get it home to install XP or Linux which has been proven to be the case time and time again. That or they just buy a Mac. You simply cannot deny the damage Vista did to the Windows market/user share, the figures are there for everyone to poke fun at, including Jobs lackeys.

How far Windows 7 goes to repair that damage remains to be seen, but if the "more of the same" crowd get the same sort of momentum as the "Lets bash Vista" crowd did, my guess is not a whole helluva lot. 7 will probably gain quite a bit in the Netbook market as people just can't be bothered faffing about with Linux and as Vista is a battery eating turd, theres some potential there.

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Last edited by OG on Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:59 am 
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hounsell wrote:
Blizzardo1 wrote:
Windows OCManage wrote:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.


I would have to disagree with you on the Memory hog thing. Honestly Vista is taking 1.3 GB of my Ram and Mac OS X is taking 340 MB of my ram on my OLD G3! :x :x :x


Vista takes every Mb of my 6Gb in my desktop.
That is a good thing. Unused RAM is wasted RAM. Vista's caching system really does make a huge difference, it really benefits a system

I can't really blame Vista. After all, Mac OS X crawl worse that Vista on 512MB ram.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:42 am 
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Blizzardo1 wrote:
Windows OCManage wrote:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.


I would have to disagree with you on the Memory hog thing. Honestly Vista is taking 1.3 GB of my Ram and Mac OS X is taking 340 MB of my ram on my OLD G3! :x :x :x


Expand your pagefile in Vista or enable prefetching. And I'm talking about recent x86 OSX (Tiger-Leopard)


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:17 am 
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Honestly, Apple is often quite stupid in their strategy. They should've released low cost laptop (not netbook).

This is how it should read:


The 13-inch MacBook Lite.

1.73GHz
Celeron Dual-Core
1GB Memory
120GB hard drive
Intel GMA 4500M graphics
Standard keyboard
White polycarbonate shell

Ships: Within 24hrs
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as low as $14.00 a month


People will camp in front of the Apple Store just to get a hold of it.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:23 am 
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Day2Die wrote:
hounsell wrote:
Blizzardo1 wrote:
Windows OCManage wrote:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.


I would have to disagree with you on the Memory hog thing. Honestly Vista is taking 1.3 GB of my Ram and Mac OS X is taking 340 MB of my ram on my OLD G3! :x :x :x


Vista takes every Mb of my 6Gb in my desktop.
That is a good thing. Unused RAM is wasted RAM. Vista's caching system really does make a huge difference, it really benefits a system

I can't really blame Vista. After all, Mac OS X crawl worse that Vista on 512MB ram.

Vista runs suprisingly well on alot of my older systems (2.0ghz Celeron which was installed with 512 mb but runs just as well on 128mb, NOT RECCOMMENDED)
Whereas the OS X Macs that I have encountered were sluggish just opening office up, and these were brand-spanking new Macs that I helped remove from the box.
Now I know that OS x isn't supposed to be run on PC hardware, but I can't even see a reason to try when I have Windows 7 discs and Vista and xp and even 98 disks that I would rather install on my hardware.
The only reason I would _Ever_ create a Hackentosh would be to rub it in the Mac Fanboi's faces when I have a more functional "Hackbook Air" than they do, and mine only cost $400 (Asus EEE anyone?)
I have used linux on my laptops, and I must say that they do have a nack for being able to startup alot faster than 7 ever did on them, but seeing as my laptops were usually created for windows 2000, i won't complain there. Linux just seems to be able to load less, because there is less there.

just my 2c

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:17 am 
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Day2Die wrote:
Windows Vista and Windows 7, certainly, are not perfect, but be assure, Windows 7 is much better overall than Windows Vista.


Which is how it should be. Windows Vista was a step up from XP and Windows 7 is a step up from Vista.

The only thing people are amazed at is the reversal of MS's typical trend of having the OS use more resources, but this is true for all OSes.

Mac OS X has needed more memory through out the years to run adequately, and Linux over the years needs more memory if you want all the bells and whistles. The thing about Linux though, is that because of it's modularity, it's very easy to strip down, so it can work on pretty much any system from 1998.

And that's really one thing that's hurt Windows is its lack of modularity. Granted, it has gotten better over time, with the separation of IE from Explorer, and the integration of features like Movie Maker into MS's Live services.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:25 am 
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I think apple has forgot the fact that MS has saved them from going bankrupt some years ago.
But the bashing was said in the Apple-Church so no big supprise.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 10:32 am 
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QuiescentWonder wrote:
Except that it's different. I guess Windows 98 should have been free considering it was built on top of Windows 95 and that Windows XP should have been free to Windows 2000 users. Every version of Windows has been built on top of the codebase of an older version of Windows. I guess that means that Snow Leopard should be free, especially considering it doesn't really have any new features at all.

Thats not the point I was making at all, what I meant was, I can't justify paying for a product that offers so little over a product I already own.

Also, like to point out that whatever Microsoft bashing I do in this thread is not in support of Apple.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:50 am 
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Day2Die wrote:
Apple, are you running scare of Windows 7?

Yes they are it seems from the ads and talks. OSX in the other hands also didn't have "new" tech, and it's running on the n years old OSX (10.0) technology too. Correct me if I'm wrong.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:27 pm 
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The problem here is that Apple want to bash Microsoft. Whatever move Microsoft takes someone, somewhere will be able to bash it.

Vista was (apparently) too radical. It was too different from XP. At least a lot of my (older, age 40+) couldn't deal with it. XP was much more familiar with systems that they "learned" to use a computer with.

7, however, isn't radical enough. It looks just like Vista (really!?). I haven't had one customer contact me about upgrading when 7 comes out. Even when I mention it, people reckon they will stick with Vista.

Back to the main point. Apple's "get a mac" adverts have lost all their humour now that MS is using the "I'm a PC" line - IMO to GREAT effect.

I like the way MS don't retaliate to Apple, but the "I'm a PC" adverts are a very subtle, humourous, "F' You" in Apple's direction.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:55 pm 
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Blizzardo1 wrote:
Windows OCManage wrote:
You need a LOT of RAM to run Vista. No you don't. It ran fine on my 2004 ASUS P4SD-LA Mobo with 512MB DDR RAM. OSX on the other hand seems memory hungry, it took up 1.75GB on my machine.


I would have to disagree with you on the Memory hog thing. Honestly Vista is taking 1.3 GB of my Ram and Mac OS X is taking 340 MB of my ram on my OLD G3! :x :x :x


It all depends on you're memory capacity.

Vista and up have the superfetch service enabled, this fills all of the memory with the program you open often which is loading faster.
But look in the taskmanager.

While my Windows 7 is idle, it uses 1.57gb of memory of my 8gb which is much.
But use the classic theme, disable the theme service, reboot the machine and it uses only 1.37gb of memory.

Windows uses a portion of the memory for the svchost.exe with the -k switch (theme service).
But if you have less memory, windows 7 runs that process with less memory.

So it all depends on you're pc RAM configuration how much it uses and which applications are running atm.

(My high memory use is because I run many other programs in the background, internal webserver, anti-virus, music and so on).

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:13 pm 
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Apple's stuff are way overpriced. Standard laptop with windows had dropped to $500 average, but whats the macbook still at? $1000? What, I could buy a notebook and a desktop with that.

The only thing I give a thumbs up to is that they finally replaced that Intel graphic accelerator with a nvidia 9400.


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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:27 pm 
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XDude wrote:
The only thing I give a thumbs up to is that they finally replaced that Intel graphic accelerator with a nvidia 9400.

Finally, after the Windows-based laptops are using dedicated graphic cards for years. 8-)

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 PostPost subject: Re: Apple bashes Windows 7 at WWDC        Posted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 9:14 pm 
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FarCry3r wrote:
XDude wrote:
The only thing I give a thumbs up to is that they finally replaced that Intel graphic accelerator with a nvidia 9400.

Finally, after the Windows-based laptops are using dedicated graphic cards for years. 8-)


As have Apple...

And it should be noted, the 9400M is integrated. This is very common in 13.3" laptops, that or very weak dedicated video cards, which the 9400M is on par with.


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