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 PostPost subject: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:55 pm 
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I have noticed, that my news topic was deleted. It was neither just locked or explained to my why it was moved. Now it just says "You are not authorized to read this forum".

The topic was about Skype: viewtopic.php?t=24641

I would appreciate some explanation, thanks.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:15 pm 
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It's my understanding that the higher-ups have been trying to reform the News forum to be strictly beta and abandonware news.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:22 pm 
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linuxlove wrote:
It's my understanding that the higher-ups have been trying to reform the News forum to be strictly beta and abandonware news.


Yes, but for example this non-beta related news topic still exists:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24622

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:42 pm 
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I've been having issue with the same recently. Still kind of ironic considering the rest of the board is littered with garbage such as My Little Pony topics.
Consistency, or at least formal guidelines, would be nice!

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:53 pm 
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Derf wrote:
I've been having issue with the same recently. Still kind of ironic considering the rest of the board is littered with garbage such as My Little Pony topics.
Consistency, or at least formal guidelines, would be nice!

s/garbage/grea-- *shot*
Oh fine.

But yeah, I too would like some guidelines on things like this.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:19 pm 
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I think that more relevent in this case is that it could have been interpreted as to starting to discuss quite shady topics - obviously discussing how to hack skype accounts wouldn't be allowed on this forum.

Personally, I think that it was over-hyped and that there was no risk from discussing it because the risk from the flaw being discussed was hugely overblown, but I can understand why someone would err on the side of caution in that case.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:52 pm 
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We will be clarifying the rules in the near future, but for now news should be kept on-topic for the site - alpha, beta and abandonware topics.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 7:49 pm 
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First of all (as I've already explained in PMs), these "pony" topics were not news. If you post stuff like that in offtopic or VIP then it's fine since those forums allow it. If you had posted a "pony" thread in news you would have gotten a warning for spamming the forum.

Second, a post about Skype vunerabilities has nothing to do with this site. It's generic news and is better suited elsewhere, BA deals with betas, abandonware and in some extent source code, which brings me to the third point...

News about potential source leaks could be interesting since we do collect source code (closed source code that is), so it's relevant even if a case-to-case judgement has to be done.

As for the news, keep them to betas and abandonware and the occasional "major legislation" news such as SOPA, CISPA-related etc may be allowed since it may very well change the nature of what is allowed to be posted or not the net, and in the end on this forum. But even in this case it's judged individually - a legislation covered only in the US for example would be fairly unimportant as it doesn't affect BA or the majority of the members. A legislation covering EU would however. Again, a per case judgement will be done here.

I don't think we need to make some another rule about this, just use your judgement. We're a beta and abandonware site, you don't need to be a member of the Mensa society to figure out what kind of news would fit on a site like this. But for some of you slowpokes out there Andy and I will try to make some kind of guidelines of what's appropriate on the forum. But it's one of many changes that will make sure that BetaArchive stays what it's always been - a beta/abandonware forum and nothing else.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:03 pm 
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Again, you're saying two seperate things in one post.
Nowhere did I say or suggest that the "ponies" topics were posted as news. As you've told me via PM and as you've just said, you're trying to keep BetaArchive a "beta/abandonware forum and nothing else". If that's true, and if you're to be consistent, my point about allowing topics such as the "ponies" being hypocritical stands. It doesn't matter where the topic is posted, if what you're saying is the direction you're actually heading in then those topics should be deleted as they have less relevance to a "beta/abandonware forum" then a topic about Skype or Windows Phone, in my case.
We're not slowpokes for not being able to keep up with the flip flopping on the matter, it's just a bit confusing when some topics get by being totally irrelevant and others don't.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:14 pm 
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Eugh... sorry if I am harsh now but this is becoming silly real fast, one shouldn't have to explain themselves more than one time....
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No it's not hypocritical because they were posted on SEPARATE FORUMS. Forums that allow and disallow different kinds of topics. Can't you understand the difference between "News" and "Jokes and Funny Stuff"? You're not allowed to post about Linux in the Microsoft section or a request for a new Win 8 beta in the Apple section either but that doesn't mean you're not allowed to post about Linux and Win 8 beta requests at all. I don't see what your problem with understanding this is? If you want to post about your Lumia 900 issues in the Offtopic or VIP section then fine, you're more than welcome to. But the NEWS section is for stuff that directly relates to this forums main subjects. Other subjects have other forum sections, created just for the chance that someone wants to bring up an issue that isn't beta/abw related. These are the Funny section, Offtopic or VIP section. Everything else has a specific range of topics allowed in them, and the "Announcements and News" section is for BetaArchive related stuff ONLY. So far I have not seen Andy or me announce in the Announcement forum that we got new phones, or that Nokia has released a new phone or whatever. It's for news and items directly related to what this site is about.

And I never said or implied that the "pony" thread was posted as news nor that you implied it, but I mentioned it to try to make you understand the difference between the posts and why both of them are allowed, but not in the same forum. Because you can't do something at one place doesn't mean you can't do it at all.

So, just to make it clear to you and everyone else (so far it's only been you that has voiced so much confusion about this matter):

  • News: Beta/abw news. We're not interested in world news, politics, what Lady Gaga is wearing this week or what new model Toyota is making. Since all that is not relevant to this site. But if you like that kind of stuff then there's Offtopic for that.
  • New BETA/RTM Releases: Software stuff here you know. BetaArchive doesn't care much about radioactivity nor RTM releases of cars or the new Dell server. Again, Offtopic for such things, or Computer discussion if you want to discuss Dell servers.
  • Computer Discussion: Computers. Not cars, fridges, new IKEA furniture or new recepies of spanish pancakes. Again, Offtopic for that.
  • Site Feedback and Support: Feedback regarding this site. Not Microsofts, Apples or anyone elses. Just this one. If you hate Apples forums or website then head onto the Offtopic section...
    Trading forum: Trading computer hardware and software. Even tips of computer hardware/software trades elsewhere. But if you want to sell your car, cat or diamond fitted Rolex then head out somewhere else. eBay for example.

and so on... do I need to clarify further? Should we make a specific list of allowed items for each forum? Do you see where I am heading? Do you understand what BetaArchive represents? Sure, the News cleanup is a recent one but after having some 20+ news removed recently it should be clear by now what the intentions are. Not to mention that the few members that inquired about their "missing" news seems to have understood why when explained to them.

Except you. Why's that? I don't really know what your interests are, but if you were on a forum created for and by car enthusiasts, would you post a news header there about a new Windows 8 beta release? I sure wouldn't...

If you want to discuss this further you can always contact me in private and I can explain why and how it has come to this but I don't see a reason for this to be more dramatic than it already is...

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:43 pm 
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I understand pretty fine now, though your wording in your initial post did lead to confusing considering you said that you were trying to make sure, and I quote, "BetaArchive stays what it's always been - a beta/abandonware forum and nothing else", when you perhaps should have said you were trying to make sure that the "news forum stays relevant to what it's always been...", because unless I am woefully confused every other forum is part of BetaArchive.

Just a bit of poor wording led to confusion of a couple of members is all (I've had people IM me after reading this topic about it, so I'm certainly not the only one confused. :-)), but I understand your intent now.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Deleted news topic?        Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:51 pm 
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Well, perhaps the word "forum" is a bit misleading since it implies both the whole forum site and the individual sections of it (i.e forum sections). Better would perhaps be Forum > Sections > Threads or something. But my main point is that the forum as a whole (i.e BetaArchive) will only be a beta/abandonware forum, and the main sections (i.e News, New beta releases etc) will only cover topics related to betas and abandonware. Naturally I didn't mean that BA was about betas/abandonware strict to the letter (if that had been true the half of the forum sections would have been gone by now). Since we do have non-beta/abw forums here we allow a certain degree of offtopic discussion as well, but that doesn't mean it applies onto every forum section here. And overall we try to keep BA as much as a beta/abw site we can and not degrade it into some cheap generic social after dinner site. We try to be a social community but only for people that are interested in what we started up for, which are betas and abandonware titles.

Changes will be done to the forum and overall site over time but regardless what happens BA will always be a community for beta and abandonware collectors, all attempts of change will be focused towards that. After all, people don't come here to discuss politics, cars, food or other stuff.

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