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 PostPost subject: Is this true?        Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:48 pm 
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From slashdot:

"Fedora is going to pay Microsoft to let them distribute a PC operating system. Microsoft is about to move from effectively owning the PC hardware platform to literally owning it. Once Windows 8 is released, hardware manufacturers will be forced to ship machines that refuse to run any software that is not explicitly approved by Microsoft — and that includes competing operating systems like Linux. Technically Fedora didn't have to go down this path. But, as this article explains, they are between a rock and a hard place: if they didn't pay Microsoft to let them onto the PC platform, they would have to explain to their potential users how to mess with firmware settings just to install the OS. How long before circumventing the secure boot mechanism is considered a DMCA violation and a felony?"

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:54 pm 
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I don't think this is true. Microsoft wouldn't risk that much just to dominate the market, which they essentially already do. It's just some random crap that someone came up with.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:59 pm 
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Yes, it is.
http://www.fsf.org/campaigns/secure-boo ... cted-boot/

So much for Microsoft being all for freedom of the little guy.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:05 pm 
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The question is, even though Microsoft doesn't require Secure Boot on x86 and hardware manufacturers provide an option to disable it in the BIOS, how long will it be before the hardware manufacturers remove the option to disable Secure Boot?

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:04 am 
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Its only going to be required on ARM tablets, x86/64 devices IIRC will still be able to boot other OSes. Funny thing is the iPad doesn't let you boot Linux either yet nobody has ever made a fuss. I've always noticed a double standard exists out there when it comes to things like this.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:10 am 
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spunker88 wrote:
Its only going to be required on ARM tablets, x86/64 devices IIRC will still be able to boot other OSes. Funny thing is the iPad doesn't let you boot Linux either yet nobody has ever made a fuss. I've always noticed a double standard exists out there when it comes to things like this.

Seconded. Apple devices (meaning iPad, iPod, iPhone) are locked to iOS and nothing else, but nobody complains. As soon as there's a hint that Microsoft might do something similar, it's a threat to all that is good and free in software. Annoying. Besides, I don't care if it becomes illegal at some ill-defined point in the future. If I want to install a Windows alternative, I will do so.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:12 am 
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spunker88 wrote:
Its only going to be required on ARM tablets, x86/64 devices IIRC will still be able to boot other OSes. Funny thing is the iPad doesn't let you boot Linux either yet nobody has ever made a fuss. I've always noticed a double standard exists out there when it comes to things like this.

EDIT: Ignore this post, just found this which seems to correspond with what you're saying:
http://www.softwarefreedom.org/blog/201 ... -down-ARM/

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 5:27 am 
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Just wondering, if the system won't load the OS due to a root kit how exactly are you supposed to clean it if the system won't boot?


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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 7:36 am 
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F8 -> Safe Mode -> Et voilà!


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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 7:42 am 
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compgeke wrote:
Just wondering, if the system won't load the OS due to a root kit how exactly are you supposed to clean it if the system won't boot?

I'm pretty sure they mentioned in a recent Building Windows 8 post that the OS comes with a separate module (replacing the old BIOS options menu) that includes the System Recovery and similar functions, that will start up automatically if the main OS is bricked for whatever reason. So it's covered.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 10:49 am 
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CaptainPeanut wrote:
F8 -> Safe Mode -> Et voilà!

Ummm... what about Tablets? we are talking about them....

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 1:48 am 
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evangelikevin wrote:
spunker88 wrote:
Its only going to be required on ARM tablets, x86/64 devices IIRC will still be able to boot other OSes. Funny thing is the iPad doesn't let you boot Linux either yet nobody has ever made a fuss. I've always noticed a double standard exists out there when it comes to things like this.

Seconded. Apple devices (meaning iPad, iPod, iPhone) are locked to iOS and nothing else, but nobody complains. As soon as there's a hint that Microsoft might do something similar, it's a threat to all that is good and free in software. Annoying. Besides, I don't care if it becomes illegal at some ill-defined point in the future. If I want to install a Windows alternative, I will do so.


They're not. Android successfully runs on iPod/iPhone (I've done it). Drivers for audio and camera just haven't been made yet.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 1:50 am 
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Gamma wrote:
They're not. Android successfully runs on iPod/iPhone (I've done it). Drivers for audio and camera just haven't been made yet.

They are. There's a reason they've only managed to make Android run on the iPhone 2G.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 2:00 am 
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linuxlove wrote:
Gamma wrote:
They're not. Android successfully runs on iPod/iPhone (I've done it). Drivers for audio and camera just haven't been made yet.

They are. There's a reason they've only managed to make Android run on the iPhone 2G.

Let me be more specific. Apple devices are constructed such that they are only "allowed" to run iOS, and running anything else requires significant hacks. Therefore, you cannot say that they're NOT locked to iOS, since getting anything else to run requires circumventing the locking measures. That's like arguing that a safe was unlocked just because you were able to break the combination.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Sun Jun 03, 2012 9:29 am 
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Running another system on an iDevice requires you to be able to inject your own payload code into the bootrom. We use this for bootrom-level jailbreaks, and we use this for OpeniBoot, which is a custom bootloader. From it, we can load Linux, Android etc.

So far, it is only possible on devices with CPUs up to A4 (thanks to geohot and pod2g for necessary exploits for this). That means that iPhone 4S, iPad 2, and the new iPad aren't supported.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:46 am 
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evangelikevin wrote:
compgeke wrote:
Just wondering, if the system won't load the OS due to a root kit how exactly are you supposed to clean it if the system won't boot?

I'm pretty sure they mentioned in a recent Building Windows 8 post that the OS comes with a separate module (replacing the old BIOS options menu) that includes the System Recovery and similar functions, that will start up automatically if the main OS is bricked for whatever reason. So it's covered.

and how do you keep that recovery area safe as well?


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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 3:51 am 
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If it's anything like 7's, it'll be stored on a separate partition. If THAT fails, then you're probably screwed no matter what.

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 PostPost subject: Re: Is this true?        Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:10 am 
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I would think that the "recovery module" would be stored in a PROM; write once, read many. Just a guess.

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